hi everyone i'm tara lon welcome to timeout with tinseltown mom i'm here today with jenny marie batistan an author and licensed marriage family therapist today we're going to talk about technology addiction among youth and signs your kids may be addicted hi jeannie marie welcome oh good morning or good afternoon yes good afternoon i know it's afternoon now i know it feels the days just keep like going into running into each other the time it does so thanks so much for being here today can you ju
st give us a little introduction about who you are your area of practice sure so i'm a licensed marriage family therapist i'm based out of burbank california we have an office also in santa clarita and i'm also licensed in nevada tennessee georgia washington oregon and hopefully soon new york so i have clients from pretty much around the country i started off working on a high school campus um in my early years of career it's interesting because i was nervous about what i have to say to teenager
s and my pre-teenage daughter at the time was like mom you'll be great you know all my friends love you so i was like oh okay um and i soon learned that i loved working with teenagers which was so much fun um and then i subsequently wrote two books um actually guided towards teenagers using the principle of mindfulness and how they can just you know feel a little bit more free from the anxiety and the stress of our world and just accept themselves a little bit more non-judgmentally um as well as
well as just you know interact with their parents with a little less judgment oh okay great great but thank you again for being here i know you can give us a lot of great insight into our youth of today so today we're talking about technology addiction among our youth and i know a lot of parents are probably concerned and wondering if their child even falls within that category but first i want to ask you as a professional is there a such thing as a technology addiction yeah you know in 2018 th
e world health organization actually added to the diagnostic criteria gaming addiction so it is something that is now being more seen as possibly an addiction that's out there while the psychology manuals don't quite yet label it that we have done a lot of research over the past 10 years and we're seeing it increase and we're seeing the effects on uh even you know younger kids not just our teenagers and they believed back in 2012 maybe about 14 percent of teens had lines of a gaming addiction an
d most recently a big study that came out in 2020 um suggests that it might be somewhere in the neighborhood of actually 20 percent and with this past year of being in the pandemic there is some concern that that may have rised as much as 30 of teenagers may have some form of a gaming addiction oh wow so before we talk about what that looks like the gaming addiction uh let's talk about just from your professional experience like on average how much technology time is expected from teens like wha
t what's the norm like let's start like with child and then 14. and i know it's different because of the pandemic but just like generally speaking like what are the experts say you know originally we thought that you know possibly the technology involvement of kids was somewhere in the neighborhood of one to two hours but we're starting to realize that pretty consistently it can be as much as three to four hours and then of course with this pandemic we're seeing in excess of six to eight hours d
aily the kids are connected to either their gaming devices or social media um on their phones um some computer used also with the social media but primarily on the phones okay and is that considered normal right now no not normal um other than we kind of were trying to balance out well you know it was socialization for kids because it was the only social connection um and most of us experts really would like to see that that's you know kept to a minimum of an hour hour and a half a day just beca
use we know there's something different about socializing through a game or on social media versus that face-to-face interaction okay so i'm just going back to the technology addiction what is the age that someone can actually have an addiction to gaming or technology yeah unfortunately we're seeing it younger younger we have some kids even in our practice of eight nine years old that parents are having you know significant problems with kids having an outburst when they're taking their games aw
ay when they won't buy them more robux um or they can't have more time on you know various different games that they've uh found you know rewards in you know playing so it can start as young as eight nine we typically start to see it more around that uh pre-adolescent age 12 13 14 which you know kids of that age are a little bit awkward socialization can be a little bit awkward so we can see how gaming can be feel a little safer to maybe socialize with their friends for that um so first it becom
es a safe place that they can explore and hang out with their friends um to avoid the discomfort of you know the awkwardness of the actual face to facial association yeah and i can imagine there's probably more of that uh during covet where you know they've been out of school for most of the school year so they're used to socialization online as opposed to in person so it might be even hard for them to even go back to like normal like person socialization a lot of kids and youth um yes so just f
or parents listening um what are some signs that they should be looking for to let them know that their child might fall into this category yeah you know if you're seeing some sadness or anxiety with your kids when you know they're separated from their digital devices um or you know let's say the internet goes down and your kid just totally has a meltdown about it um there might be some signs that this is becoming out of balance that this is you know bridging past just a you know a habit and rea
lly kind of moving more into an addiction um or if they just have a generally lost sense of inability to regulate their time they tell you that they're only going to spend 30 minutes on the game and two hours later you're trying to get them off the game or the bigger thing that we're seeing is kids they're just losing interest in some of the day-to-day activities such as their sports activities or going and hanging out with friends or you know engaging with their schoolwork so those are some ear
ly signs that we definitely can see that they might be getting out about so so let's say there's a parent who's very concerned that you know their child falls within that category like what should be their first course of action if maybe you know that's their child you're talking about how a conversation i think it starts there um and also what are we modeling to our kids so i think we need to watch and see what are we doing with our technology devices you know are we at dinner time do we have o
ur phones with us um are we sitting on the couch and you know connected to our phones when our kids come out to talk to us do we put our device down or do we kind of keep it in our hands so watch what we're doing and just start with the dialogue first um it's the first step that i usually suggest parents have okay so then where should they go from there let's say they have the conversation do they have to seek professional help for them is that the next step i would usually suggest parents first
go to the american association of pediatrics and pull up their media plan sit down with your kids have a more in-depth conversation and see if you guys can come up together with a reasonable media plan now if your kids becoming resistant to this they're having behavior outbursts then that's a point where maybe you do need to get some intervention with a therapist and you know if we catch it early enough a lot of times these behaviors can be turned around as little as six to eight weeks we can s
tart to get some changes with kids so if someone truly does have this addiction i know you know something in the brain is affected is it the same thing with technology or is it different i mean i know it's kind of early this statistics out there but is there any thought that you can give us towards that definitely we definitely feel that it is very similar and so some individuals are going to be more predisposed just because of brain chemistry um so when they're playing the games and they win or
they achieve certain levels they're getting a dopamine release and dopamine is that really good feel good type of hormone so um it definitely propels that reward seeking and they want more and more and this is where the gaming can really become out of balance so when we used to get that hit of dopamine within 30 minutes 45 minutes of the game and maybe we just progressed to one level now kids are wanting to progress two levels three levels four levels to get the same amount of dopamine release
so that's why we want to really want to watch the behavior if it's starting to increase the time it gets more preoccupied you're probably you know using that gaming device to get that dopamine hit so really trying to teach them some other coping skills for when i'm feeling overwhelmed stressed out you know sad depressed about something that's going on in my world rather than turning into a gaming device what else can we do that's that's good advice yeah so i'm just helping parents out you know m
oms especially because you know there's a lot of moms listening a lot of times the kids will be on their device and it's almost time for them to put it away and they're in the middle of a game and that's probably the hardest time to actually get them off their device do you have any strategy there you know just kind of like making that transition a little bit more seamless for parents yeah you know i have a lot of parents who have adopted like a kitchen timer technique um you know get the old-fa
shioned kitchen timer or reset a time where you're putting it with the kids and you guys are pre-determined hey we're going to have an hour of gaining time tonight so let's set a timer so you can see it so you can watch and then actually you know if you can try to come in and give them that 20 minute warning like hey just want to remind you 20 minutes left of game time start wrapping it up um so the kids don't feel like it's an abrupt you come in and it's like time to get off time to go to bed u
m or it's that five minute warning might be a little not enough time so to kind of give them that 20 minute transition um or use a kitchen timer technique to help them be prepared for oh i need to be wrapping up my times on the stuff so let's say the time is up and the kid is still like oh i'm just let me can i just finish this game do you do you recommend letting them just finish it or you should you just cut it off like so you can ask how much time do how much time do you need if it's five min
utes okay wrap this level up we got five minutes um but we're not going to keep doing the game of five more minutes five more minutes five more minutes um you can do you know occasionally depending on the kid if you have a kid who's going to keep pushing those boundaries then it's best just to shut it off deal with the consequence of them being angry upset with you don't take it personal um they might say horrible things to you that may feel disrespectful just try to stay neutral and just you kn
ow relate to them i'm like yeah i know the bummer are you upset you can be mad at me that i'm making you turn the game off and then walk out of the room and let them kind of deal with their emotions in that moment without standing there letting them berate you right okay and then and i'm also hearing and i don't know if this is just hypothesis or or theories i should say that somehow mental illness might be connected to like too much gaming is that something that's out there or they're doing mor
e studies on that like what can you say about that yeah it's definitely an area that we're looking at we are looking to see if individuals with low lying anxiety and depression are more predisposed to gaming so if we kind of think of gaming as like a self-medicating tool um that's where we think that you know sometimes it's getting out of balance for individuals rather than them dealing with anxiety with the low-lying depression they're in a sense numbing that out by using the gaming so just bei
ng aware watching again for those signs like you know is your is your kid having difficulty regulating their emotions are they not taking good self-care are they not wanting to shower and bathe because they're preoccupied with their social media or their gaming um do you find that they're you know withdrawing from you and other social interactions okay and what are your thoughts on kids having more than one device that they're using at one time like do you think that's an issue like they're tryi
ng to multitask let's say they want to do to do one thing on their ipad another thing on the computer um you know just have their whole life set up like what are your thoughts on that yeah i mean you know multitasking is an interesting skill i think talking about your kids and finding out again it's all about that dialogue what's going on that they feel like they need to have that multiple stimuli is it just that their brain is a little bit more multitasking or is it an early sign that maybe the
y have some adhd that they're struggling with and it's hard for them to stay focused on a singular task or activity um or are they not getting enough reward from just playing the game that they're on and they have to also be on social media or another game on their ipad have a conversation find out what's going on there with that okay and what if in their mind they think that they need all three of those things to do whatever they need to perform accurately like do you do you still think it's ok
ay like if there's a sufficient enough answer like do you think it's okay having more than one device like that doesn't do anything like brain wise as far as a stimulus we're not sure because there's not enough research that's really looked at multiple devices at one time we do think that there's a possibility it is an over stimulation and they are not getting enough dopamine from the single device so again our concern becomes if kids are having to use multiple devices is there some type of addi
ction that's coming and we're just not getting it from a singular device if we look at you know drug use why is it one individual progresses from maybe just using weeds and now they're using other substances is it because they're not getting enough of a you know you know from those singular substance so it's the same going on with devices um it'll be interesting to see because that's one of the areas that research is kind of going in the next five years why are kids wanting to use multiple devic
es what's going on there yeah and i think there's probably some concern from parents if they sense like let's say there's a family history of addiction and maybe you know their family is prone to that maybe they think their child is prone to it maybe they're seeing some signs in the gaming or the technology and maybe they have fears that that might carry over to you know like substance abuse does that sound realistic though yeah you know we think that there's a similar mechanism that's going on
in the brain that you know why some individuals um become addicted to substances and others don't you know why is it that some individuals might become addicted to gaming and others don't so we think that there is something going on within that brain chemistry and that brain development that you know individuals are more predisposed so again if we're having to use more than one device it might be an early sign that they are getting them needing that stimulation that river stimulation and that th
ere could be a you know addiction that's starting to form there so i think it's reasonable to consider having the dialogue and encourage kids to stay with one device and helping them understand the importance of focus you know so if we can focus in on one game and stay with that how much more focused are we going to be in other areas of our life whether it's schools or social interactions or something when we actually have a job right right no that's good i've been reading a little bit about emo
tional intelligence is that something that you talk about in your practice yeah absolutely you know i we really try to teach a lot of our parents about motion coaching and it really starts at an early age helping kids to identify their emotions and have a language around our emotions so we have a fun sheet that has you know cute little emojis on it and we try to get the kids to identify what is the emotion that's coming from the emoji and what does that emotion feel like in your body um how do y
ou express that emotion uh to help them develop an emotional language as well as just around situations so maybe they're frustrated with their parents so let's talk about that yeah i'm feeling frustrated about what what specifically with your parents are you frustrated with i'm frustrated that they're you know barging into my room okay well what do you need well i need a little bit of privacy or need a little bit of you know feeling like i have my own space okay well why do you think your parent
s are barging into your room let's have a conversation around that um what feelings can you express to your parents rather than just going to anger and outbursts um but to just really explain with other feelings and emotions what's going on for them okay and do you think that um somehow too much technology can affect emotional intelligence like the maturity of it well we see the reason why we think boys are more kind of predisposed to maladaptive behaviors around gaming is that their emotional i
ntelligence really starts to kick in late adolescence early adulthood so there's some belief that really the prefrontal cortex which is the logic reason center of our brain which communicates with the emotion center of our brain isn't fully wired until about 25 26 so we kind of have to do almost some like critical thinking exercises to help them you know kind of think through what feeling might be connected here um so you know does gaming then interrupt that because we're just staying in this pl
ace of you know kind of aggression or frustration and so we're limiting um our emotional intelligence because we're just trying to work through that aggression and frustration of like i haven't gotten to the next level there's so many other range of emotions so even talking to your you know especially the boys about yeah that's a bummer you know it's disappointing when you can't get to that next level so that there's more than just anger and frustration that's experienced yeah that's i mean that
's wow that's very interesting can you think of any other advice to moms out there maybe they have some kids in that category you know especially with the boys and like like you mentioned like with the gaming and that aggression maybe they're seeing a breakdown in their emotional intellect and they're not really knowing how to communicate well with them maybe they're like pre-teens teenagers or older teens i guess you know where it's harder you know to communicate like do you have any advice the
re i know that's kind of broad so anything you can offer would be helpful yeah of course you know i think a lot of this starts early on and what's the dialogue we start having with our kids early on um and sit down with them and play you know actually spend you know 20 minutes with them you know finding out what do they love about this game can create a window to you know dialoguing more about emotions um so even for you to experience what is it like when you don't get to that next level on the
game with your kids and to talk about your own feelings surrounding the frustration or disappointment um or sadness and just you know your day-to-day experience with emotions so by modeling it with our kids they can start to create a dialogue as well and what are some other negative long-term effects of too much screen time yeah so one of the negative effects that we're worried about is then when kids need to launch into you know the workforce how are they going to interact with their co-workers
um their bosses are they gonna be able to do that and you know obviously in a really interesting time right now where more and more individuals are talking about like oh gosh you know we've worked from home successfully this past year you know can we continue to do this on a certain level and we're certainly seeing teens talk about well i'm only going to have a job where i can work from home and you know and so i have limited interaction so uh it's interesting to see you know how is our social
structure going to be set up so really trying to find activities that our kids can engage in that is not just so they're only having socialization through game time keeping them involved in sports or music activities or art class or drama classes are some really great ways to just kind of get them expanding so that they can socially relate um having your kids make a phone call um to change an appointment i think is a really great way to help our kids be able to relate socially in our world uh be
cause when you say gosh you know in our practice a lot of times we have parents that are calling for their 25 26 year old make an appointment because their kid has never been able to get on the phone and make an appointment they they feel overwhelmed by that um the thought of even getting on the phone with someone so trying to do those simple tasks or have them actually call a family member is a great way to help expand them beyond that social world that's good yeah i think even something good t
hat came from covet with that as far as the maturity level is the kids are having to interact with their teachers more so because they're online they all have their own email address so if they missed an assignment they can email their teacher directly and you know try to work through that problem so i think on that level um there's been some good out of it um even though you know it's still online and it's all technology based but you know i guess there's pros and cons to it of course absolutel
y yeah in life it's all about balance isn't it right exactly exactly um so tell me about your book i know you have two books out right tell me about your books yeah so i have the mindfulness journal for teens which has uh prompts to really kind of help them explore a lot of their emotional world and how do they deal with emotions um how do they look at their world so that they can be a little bit more present in the day uh watch for anxious thoughts watch for um you know what do i do with my sad
thoughts um what do i do with you know how do i relate to my peers my parents um so the journal's a really great place to just start to promote just like calm and peace and a non-judgmental stance to the world being present in the moment non-anxiously moving at the moment and then the mindfulness i have mindfulness for teens and 10 minutes a day which is filled with 60 different exercises that are categorized by morning midday and evening they really can help promote focus concentration there's
always great research out that if teens engage with a mindfulness activity even as little as three to five minutes a day within 30 days they report that their focus and their concentrations out and they have improved memory they would start to perform better on tests and they find that they're moving through their homework actually quicker um so a lot of my teens are like you're kidding me if i do one exercise three to five minutes a day and you need to do the full 10 minutes that your book say
s that i will spend less time on my homework and perform better on my tests and i'm like yes you will and they're like i'm not sure and i'm like well i give you a 30-day challenge give it a try um and my teams that have actually engaged with that 30-day challenge how to actually come back and report it you're right i actually am doing better on my tests i am getting through my homework quicker what is mindfulness jenny marie if you don't mind explaining that so mindfulness is the ability to stay
present in the moment uh to accept what's going on in our world without trying to push it away with judgment or anxiety and to not react with an outburst of emotion um to stay in a little bit more of a neutral zone and to be aware of what's actually going on in the moment for us to be connected to our feelings and to our thoughts and to be presently aware of what's going on around us and to have you know increased compassion for ourselves as well as others around us um so it takes us a little b
it out of being like kind of an egocentric self-centered mind and to actually have a little bit of compassion for those around us that's interesting okay is that something that you focus on in your practice yeah we do a lot of mindfulness with our teens and our adults um and there's a lot of great apps out there you know if you have kids that are a little less likely to pick up a book and read a book you know i love the headspace apps out there they have a version for the kids now and they're li
ttle exercises one of my favorite exercises to do with um write preteens is what we call superhero stance it comes out of the work of um a social psychologist that found that power posing which is kind of like standing in like that superman pose with hands on your hips and kind of like raising your shoulders up and just take a moment to look at yourself in the mirror and to just like you know embrace a positive affirmation like may i be confident today may i be focused may it be strong um and ju
st to you know hold those to be that affirmation to be true for yourself um it can be just really an empowering moment for our kids if they just kind of do that little superman pose especially if they have a presentation they need to do at school before they they head out or another great mindfulness activity is just you know paying attention to our breath you know i love foursquare breathing which is breathing in for a count of four holding your breath for a count of four breathing up for four
and then holding your breath for a count four and just do four or five cycles of that so if your kids feel a little anxious um they can do it in the classroom no one needs to even know so like before they take a test or before they give a presentation or even if they're going to go out and give you know a friend that they're you know new social interaction um it's nice to do just a little bit of mindful reading yeah i've been hearing more and more people talk about mindfulness i just haven't don
e the research to see what it is is it affiliated with any religion of any sort or does it infringe upon any religions it doesn't really i mean it comes out of probably some old buddhist tendencies um but the modern version of mindfulness tends to be more free of any you know sort of religious um aspect you know i think a lot of other faiths think of like meditation or you know even like you know singing songs or you know reading a religious text could be a form of mindfulness as well um prayer
you know would be a form of mindfulness uh so you know mindfulness i think really kind of is you know come out of different aspects of religion but really is free of religious bias at this point right so you kind of take it as your own like depending on what your own beliefs are you kind of practice your own whatever if it's involved in your faith or whatnot um and i think a lot of it comes out of you know even kind of that golden rule piece of like you know do unto others as you know you would
have done unto yourself i think there's a lot of that mindfulness principles of having compassion for you know your fellow person uh in your life and you know how would i treat them how would i have compassion for them as i would want them to have compassion right okay well you are just a wealth of information jenny marie where can people find you if they want to know more about you and your practice yeah so you can find me on instagram at hope underscore therapy underscore center or hope hyphen
therapyhyphencenter.com on the web and we have facebook page as well that's just hope therapy center thanks so much for listening to timeout with tinseltown mom if you liked what you heard today please be so kind and rate review and subscribe on itunes or wherever you listen a podcast until next time you
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