Beth: Hey, welcome friend. This is your Enneagram coach, the podcast,
and I'm Beth McCord, your Enneagram coach. And at YEC, we're passionate about
unlocking the transformative power of the Enneagram from a Christian perspective
to enrich your life and relationships. We do this with lots of engaging podcasts,
insightful books, and dynamic courses. You can find all of that
at your Enneagram coach. com. Now with these tools, we provide
you with many resources that you'll need for the lasting growt
h and
change that you're looking for. We also train exceptional Enneagram
coaches who are well equipped to guide you on your journey in your
personal and relational growth. You can find a coach
today@myenneagramcoach.com. If you are an Enneagram enthusiast
who loves learning and talking all things Enneagram, then you should
consider becoming an Enneagram coach and take our training now. To get a free taste of our training,
just watch our mini course. You can see it@yourenneagramcoach.com. Now in
today's episode is going to be
quite the treat because I'm giving you an exclusive peek into a real Enneagram
coaching session with a specific type. Whether you're listening in or
watching on our YouTube channel, you'll get to see an actual coaching
session unfold right before your eyes. I know many of you are learning
about the Enneagram through books and blogs and podcasts, but you
probably haven't had the chance to see a real live coaching session. Well, today is that day because I
thought,
you know, this would be a perfect time for you to experience what
it's actually like so I put a call out to see who would volunteer to be excited
to be coached by me and to take you through one of our YEC guide sheets. And the response was incredible. So many people came out of the war works. It was hard to pick just nine because
we're going to take you through all nine types over the course of nine weeks. But I did choose one from each type. So in these episodes, I'm going
to walk you through e
ach type's initial coaching session. The same one that I teach our coaches
to take their clients through, because these guide sheets are
packed with valuable insights about. that person's type, but more importantly,
will help the person to go beyond just understanding the Enneagram and know
how to apply it to their everyday lives, which you're going to see that today. Well, Hey, Greg, it's so fun to see you. And I can't wait to take you
through this guide sheet. Number one. Um, how are you doing
Gregory: by the way? I'm doing really well. Things are going well. Beth: Good. Well, I'm sure we can unpack quite
a bit in the first guide sheet. So we'll get to kind of see
different highs and lows. Um, and just really kind of
focusing on a particular. Part or circumstance or
situation that you're feeling stuck in or struggling with. And then what I'll do is I'll
try to bring the insights we're going through in the guide sheet
and we'll leave that in and out. And I, you know, by the end, my
su
spicion and what I see usually is that people have new aha moments and
new ideas of how to move forward that. Either they had considered in the past
or it's totally new, but either way, they're feeling a little bit more freedom. They're feeling like they've
got, you know, like a new path or a healthier path to walk down. And that's really what, you
know, my goal is for you today. Does that sound Gregory: good? That sounds Beth: terrific. Okay. So on the guide sheet, so, you know,
it's on the scr
een right now and, uh, people want to watch on YouTube, um,
on our YouTube channel, they'll see it. But so what we have here is five
words for the type four that walk you through kind of the healthy
to the less healthy aspects. Um, so I know that we had talked
earlier and you said that. You would prefer to read, which is great. So if you can read those, and then
when you're done, tell me which words stood out the most to you and why. And it can be several of them,
uh, positive negatives, whateve
r, what really struck a chord Gregory: in you. The romantic individualist, authentic,
creative, expressive, deep temperamental. So for me, well, all of those
are true, but what jumps out at me today is the creative. Um, because I am immersed
in, um, creating for my work. So creating new trainings that
have not done, been done before. And, uh, just came back from a
weekend where I did training at an adoption and foster conference. And. Um, two trainings that, um, that
came out of me and my experi
ence and interwoven different aspects together
into something new and hopefully helpful for the people who showed up. Beth: Yeah. Oh, I'm sure it was. Yeah. Cause even just kind of reading
about your bio and the things that you've gone through and then bringing
that into the lives of others. I'm really. I'm positive. They were very, um, influenced
and benefit from it. Um, okay. Was there any other words that Gregory: popped up? Um, the, what, one of the words that
caught my attention was tempera
mental. I said, what does that mean? Temperamental. And I'm going, Oh, temperamental
as in you're going along fine. And something happens and
boom, you are going in. A different direction. Yeah, that's me. I can be, especially years past,
I can be doing really well and something bad happens and you know,
it just, I'll just sit in the yuck. Um, and it can happen the other way
too, that something good happens, but I remember being, well, and then. Yeah. Beth: And would, would you say that other
pe
ople might use the word, uh, you're being temperamental or, or would they
use a different word, um, in those times? Gregory: That's interesting. That's one of the words that
nobody has ever used for me about being temperamental. Yeah. Beth: Interesting. And it's interesting that it
popped up right now for you. Gregory: Yeah. Beth: Okay. Well, that's, that's really Gregory: interesting. Yes. And hopefully nowadays I'm not as I
have been doing a lot of this work. Right. And so I am going with equa
nimity
and trying to stay stable and not be on the emotional rollercoaster. Beth: Yeah. Yeah. And we'll definitely get into that, um,
as we go through this, but I love that word equanimity and a lot of people. I wasn't familiar with it before
the Enneagram and just that it means emotional balance. And I'm, I'm wondering when you first
heard it, cause I think a lot of force when they first hear something like
that, they think, or probably what the world has, maybe the message it's
tried to give y
ou is tamp down your emotions or get rid of your emotions,
which that's not what equanimity means. It means. Having your emotions, but more
self regulated emotions, healthy emotions, you know, highs and
lows, being able to see it all. Does that feel more like it resonates Gregory: with you? Yeah, it's almost if I, if you picture,
you know, the up and down and that center line of being anchored to that
centered and be more observational of, Oh, whoa, going up here. Oh, wow. Going down here. And E
nneagram has given me permission
that I don't have to go with it. Beth: Interesting. Okay. So before your, did you feel like you,
so what I'm hearing is your internal world said you have to go with the
highs and you have to go with the lows. Is Gregory: that right? Yeah. It was almost like, well, why
wouldn't I, what, what's the option? No, you can't, you have to, you
know, it's just like normal. Beth: Yeah. Well, I'm assuming authenticity is so
important for the four that by, let's say, not goi
ng with it, did it in the
past feel like you were being inauthentic? Gregory: I think that would be a fair
statement, um, of just being, I'm going to go here because this is where I am
and, and how could I be any different than where I'm at at this moment? Beth: That's so interesting. Okay. So now, of course, as we get
older, hopefully we're all Trying to grow right in life. I'm sure there's some people that
don't grow, but as we've gotten older and mature, and we've gone through
lots of these d
ifferent seasons, sounds like you've learned how
equanimity is still authentically you, but more self regulated. So what does that feel like as a four? Gregory: Oh, wow. Um, I do have, and hopefully the positive
sense of, of pride of going, whoa. I don't have to go there and it
feels actually, it feels really good if I'm around, um, let's say
my youngest child and normally what used to trigger me in the past. And I go ahead and respond from a more
stable place and don't go emotional. I'm going,
Hey, Hey. Well done, buddy. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's pretty, it's pretty exciting
and it feels great to be doing that, that I don't have to go on a ride
just because my emotions go there. Beth: Yeah. And it doesn't mean it's not you, like,
cause you're still being you, even though you're able to be more self Gregory: regulated. Yeah. I, I like me self regulated
a lot better than not. Yeah. Life's life's a lot more fun. Right. Self regulated. Beth: Interesting. I love that. Um, okay. So let's move
to the core
motivations and the core motivations are that driving force behind
why we think, feel, and behave. Um, and there's the core fear, which
are always running away from, or trying to prevent from happening. You have a core desire. And this is like, Oh man, if I
just had this, like life would be like, just the way I want it. The core weakness, this is. the Achilles heel, the thorn in your side,
that thing that keeps tripping you up. Um, and we'll until we go to
heaven, but we do find if w
e're learning and growing some reprieve,
but it's still going to be there. Um, and then we have a core longing. This is the message our heart
longs to hear and experience. So do you mind reading all four of those? And then we'll kind of see what. What pops up for you, especially
with maybe a circumstance that you're kind of feeling stuck in or Gregory: struggling with. Okay, super core motivations, core
fear, being inadequate, emotionally cut off, plain, mundane, defective,
flawed, or insignific
ant, core desire, being unique, special, and finding your
authentic self, core weakness, envy, feeling that you're tragically flawed. Something foundational is missing
inside you and others possess qualities that you lack core longing. You are seen and loved for exactly
who you are special and unique. Beth: That's great. Okay. So what, what are you dealing with right
now and how is all of these kind of like, maybe signals are going off in your mind? Like, Oh my gosh, I can totally
see how these
things are happening. Gregory: Oh, well. You know, one of the, one of the
things, when I look at the core fear, um, for me, I have always
for decades for well over 40 years. Um, I worked for companies where I
provided help, support, I, I, I did, was a church pastor for over 40 years and then
worked for a company, um, helping post adoption, um, with post adoption support. But then in 2021, I decided to
go off, go off at, you know, 63 years of age and start my own
business to, to do post adoption
support and do Enneagram coaching. So that's the, that within that context,
I have never, ever, ever had to. Ask somebody to pay me money for
services that I've provided because the church paid me to do that. And then the company that I worked
for, they paid me to do that. And so now I, so I think core
fear has something to do with that hesitancy of, well, uh, inadequate,
um, defective, flawed, insignificant. Who am I that I should. Ask people to do that, uh, to,
to pay for my life experience an
d the resources I have. I mean, I, I do, I have a treasure
trove of experiences and, um, successes and failures to share. But it's pretty tough. Um, I have to really have to suppress
a part of myself to go ahead and, and ask for that to market myself. I actually even just marketing myself. So the other part of that
would be, um, related is that. If I stick my head up above the water
and say I'm an expert or I'm really good at something like that, you know,
if I, if I put myself up too high, you
know, my head might just get lopped off. You know, I don't know by somebody
saying you're not all that. Right. Or actually there is no
concrete what might go bad. It's just that feeling. Beth: Yeah. Well, and with the, kind of the, um,
the core fear of the sick, I mean, that's the four, I wonder if it's
like, well, if I put myself out there, but other people expose or see or
say in some form or fashion, but I don't really, I'm, I'm insignificant
or that I am defective and flawed, or I'm missing
something important. Does that, does that kind Gregory: of feel true? Yes. See, that would be the getting lopped off. If you get up too high, right? Then people are going to be, if you
expose yourself too much, you make yourself a bigger target for people
going up defective, flawed, inadequate. Which Beth: is your greatest fear. And so it's, I mean, there's
everything in you that is saying, I don't want to go close to that. So I'm going to pull myself back
away from that as much as possible. But
what happens for you when you
pull yourself too far back from that? Like what, how does it inhibit you? Or what are the consequences that you Gregory: experience? Well, the consequences are the
two professionally and personally. I mean, one is, um. That people who I really want to help
and would like to help don't get my resources, my knowledge, my compassion
or my connections so that they know that they're not alone in this journey. Yeah. Right. Which is your greatest gift. Yeah. It's, which i
s, which is real. So that's, that's a big consequence. And then of course, um, you know, less
income if you don't market yourself, then people don't know about you and Beth: yeah. And then. When we look at, because I want to
pull the, the core desire in this in just a second, but when we look at
the core weakness, which is envy, and again, it's that you're feeling that
there's something tragically and flawed missing you, that some other people
have this thing that you're missing. And so I can im
agine, and I've talked
to other fours that are like, well. You know, I see that other people can do
A, B, and C, but for some reason I can't, like there's something wrong with me. And I, I'm so afraid of that being
exposed and that it's actually true. So then I don't really, um, I'll pull back
and like maybe do something else because I'm too afraid of maybe being exposed. And so it's that envy of, but see
everyone else has what I'm lacking. Does that ring true in this? Uh, circumstance? Gregory:
A little bit. Um, I have to smile inside when you were
saying that, because I just, the adoption, adoption foster conference, right? At this year, there were a couple of my
heroes there speaking main stage and, uh, workshops and things such as that. And there was a little bit of
that Envy stuff of, oh man, I. Really, really want to be at their
level so that You know, to be able to help more people and all of that,
that was, that is an embarrassingly, um, strong feeling that, uh, that I
experien
ced that and, but I love them. They are fantastic. These are people who have been phenomenal
for me over the years and, uh, gosh, I'd like to be like them, but you know, I
can't cause I'm not as good as they are. Beth: Yeah. That's the, the reframe
in the mind, right? And then when you have that refrain
in your mind, what happens internally, but also actually physically or action
wise, like what, what comes out of that? Gregory: So for me, I feel all
of that stuff right there and. I almost, ther
e are many occasions that I
get this, and this is one of those things. If I get triggered in that way, um,
imagine something coming through my back and, and, and spreading
out and it's like a hook and it. Pulls me back. I mean the the pain is here
and it literally wants me to pull back and Disengage
completely and go, you know what? Never mind. I'm not showing up at all Beth: Wow and then And then
what happens after that? Because obviously you, let's say you
do follow and you pull yourself back.
What happens next when you withdrawn? Gregory: Nowadays, I
breathe and I get centered. Nowadays, I recognize what's going on. And my, so I do back off. And I go, okay, I think this is what we
call the Enneagram Type 4 Envy, right? And so then you name it to tame it. Um, and so I spent time, now I am not
fast to come back, but I recognize my current perspective is inaccurate. My feelings are telling me all is wrong. What was me? But I've learned enough through, through
this work to say, okay, I
really can't trust my feelings in this situation. I've got to do something to get
myself back into what I call my upstairs brain, my thinking brain. Cause that my upstairs brain, my thinking
brain is not, um, it's not binary. Okay. Yeah. Emotional brain is good, bad,
but my upstairs brain is all of a sudden everything is
more, uh, there's more options. It's not this or this,
but there's more options. And I, a couple of times I've literally
felt my brain go there and open up. Interesting. Yeah. A
couple of times. So recently I've got a, my oldest
daughter is an Enneagram four. And so it was probably a couple
of days after that, but I told her about the incident of, yeah,
this is what happened to me. And she goes, yeah, I get that. So I, I have a four who understands me. Beth: Yeah. Which I, I heard that before is
always pretty much feel misunderstood. And so how relieving. It can feel when you really thinks, Oh
no, I think they really understand me. Is that Gregory: true? Yes. It is lov
ely. Well, and for me and, and this particular
daughter, um, when I go ahead and confess, confess that, and, and she
says, yeah, I mean, we end up laughing. It's like, Oh yeah. Oh yeah. I mean, it. Which is delightful. It's, so let me tell you about this. And that's a little stereotypical
Enneagram type four, isn't it? And so we do, we end up laughing
at that's fun that I had gone. Beth: That's fun. Okay. So as we move into the next segment,
which is going to be kind of an overview of the type f
our, we've really kind
of honed in on the core fear, the desire, the weakness, the longing, and. I think, you know, but we've kind of
like put it all in the context of. Being a coach and putting
yourself out there. And like, this is a whole new
thing because in the past you were paid, you know, just to do it. And so you just got to, you know,
be you, you didn't have to like create like the actual business
part or market or find people. To help and then to ask them to pay
for your services becaus
e, well, like, what, what am I going to do with that? Like, are they going to, do they
want to, am I worthy of that? So there's all of this, these fears
and the weakness, but ultimately you're looking for The ability to be your unique
self, to show up, to be that creative self that can go into the spaces that
people really struggled, especially the work that you're doing with adoptive
families in helping them to understand attachment, uh, grief, and these different
things that you've experienced
, the creativity that you can bring is so
phenomenal, but you're doing all that. Also hoping that others will see you and
love you or appreciate, you know, kind of another, another word for exactly
who you are, the specially unique and creative person that helps them. Would that be a good kind Gregory: of summary? Yeah, that was really well said. Beth: Okay, good. So as we take that into this next
section, why don't you read, um, let's just say, go ahead and read the first
threes, the big one, a
nd then the next two paragraphs, the smaller ones,
and then we'll read the last three. Gregory: Excellent. Okay. You bring a unique beauty, depth,
creativity, and understanding to the world around you and embrace a wide
range of emotions and experiences. You're in tune with profound
despair and suffering and bravely press into those depths to discover
rich meaning and all of life. You are eager to explore our
complicated world in search of meaning and authentic connection and desire
to look insi
de yourself to find your unique significance and value. However, you feel burdened by a constant
belief that you are Alone and missing something important, craving ideal
circumstances or love, you often feel disconnected or fundamentally flawed. Struggling with feelings of envy,
you compare yourself to others, believing that those around you
possess the things for which you long. Beth: So what stood out
positives and negatives? And then kind of like wrapping it
around like this specific scenario
that you're struggling with. Gregory: Yeah. This is the problem with the Enneagram. Right. Is that you're throwing yourself out
there and everybody knows, Oh, whoa, that's, that's a little too vulnerable. So one of the things, the positive. Uh huh. Is in my unique field. There are not, there are a bunch of
post adoption support folks who are helping families, but, but they're not
compared to the number of people who are suffering from the consequences of, of
trying to promote healing in the liv
es of children that experienced abuse, neglect. trauma, all of that. So in my field, showing up litter
with creative and insights. And here, let me tell you what I saw here. Let me tell you how I experienced that. Let me tell you where I blew it. And I lost my mind. All of those things, uh, people
appreciate, they appreciate knowing where I made mistakes and I own that to them. They appreciate the insights. I said, well, this is what happened
to me and it blew up in my face. So I tried this and
it worked. And so folks are very, very
grateful when I show up for them. And most, most of the time people
say instantly, it's pretty upfront. He says, it's nice to
talk to somebody who. Get set. Nobody else understands this journey. Um, family, my closest friends, my
pastors, my church, small group, they kind of tolerate me, but they
don't get me and my circumstance. So that goes right into, you know,
The creativity and the beauty and the depth of I know the pain of this
journey, but I also kno
w the joy and I'm able to give them hope as well. So that's the positive. Um, yeah, I, I know
what despair looks like. I don't know whether it's profound or not. Yeah, I know what
hopelessness looks like, um, and when I think of you are eager to
explore our complicated world in search of meaning and authentic connection. That's one of the things that the
Enneagram has given me is that it allowed me to name that and to go,
Oh, that's what I've been doing. Um, because that, that withdrawing
thing
of being of backing up. And because sometimes I've done that
for a lot along periods of time and tried to put the pieces together. I guess that's positive too. Isn't it? Beth: Yeah, it can be a both Gregory: for sure. Um, so then jumping to the end of that. That third paragraph, struggling
with feelings of envy. You compare yourself to others. Um, yeah, that's just so real. And, and I have periods of that, you
know, where I go ahead and sit in that and luck nowadays, luckily I don't
hang out the
re as much as I used to. Beth: Yeah. Well, and where Where do you think along
the way it turned and then, well, actually we'll get there because we're going to
go into this more positive part of this. So let's have you read
the last bits of this. And then I would love to explore
how, as you've grown in just age and maturity and life experience, but
also truth and then helped your heart to steer in a different direction. Like what was that
experience like for you? So I'll let you go ahead and rea
d. Gregory: Okay. When you attempt to find your unique
significance apart from Christ, you can become self absorbed and temperamental. You are painfully self conscious, spending
a great deal of energy ruminating on how different you are from others. Sorry, I laugh at the truth. Yeah, no, it's fine. You navigate feelings of self hatred. And shame, along with emptiness
and despair, you may feel anxious around others, always wondering
what they think about you, perpetually seeing your weaknesses,
w
eakness, and never your glory. Beyond your internal strife, you
can get into relational conflicts by being moody, emotionally demanding,
withholding, dramatic, and volatile, causing you to appear self absorbed
and disinterested in others. preach. However, when you take the longings of
your heart to Christ, you can step out from under the waterfall of your emotions. That's a really good line there. Um, and bring forth your
gifts in extraordinary ways. You have a deep intuition into
other sufferin
g and can shoulder their deep pains and feelings
without being overwhelmed. It brings you great joy to connect
with others on a deep level and to support them in their distress,
which is a gift to the world. Beth: So what stood out in you in this
part, and I know you were just kind of saying, you know, as you've grown older,
you know, the things that you've grown in. And I was curious to see, like, does. This kind of paint some of that picture as Gregory: well. Yes. I mean, the, these, these par
agraphs,
very much identify the change. I am so aware of, of being self
absorbed, temperamental, self conscious, you know, great deals of. of ruminating. Um, it was described to me at
the bottom of the Enneagram. There's that four and five with the
gap in between and getting caught feeling, thinking, feeling, thinking,
feeling, thinking, and just getting lost in, in that gap and, and, and
sitting there for long, uh, for long times, long periods of time. Um, navigating the feelings
of self hatred
, Oh my gosh. Shame, emptiness, despair. Um, then I just had to laugh with
the beyond your internal strife. You can get into relational
conflicts by being moody. Oh, so much. I, I remember those times with a great
deal of embarrassment of, Of being moody around family around friends and going,
dude, you know, why did you do that? So, you know, we do the best we can
and we, until we know better, right? Moody, emotionally
demanding, um, withholding. I would do that in my marriage. Um, way too dram
atic and volatile. Um, and self absorbed. My wife once said to me, You
are the kindest self absorbed person I have ever met. On the planet, I remember where
I was sitting on the couch. I mean, I have that. I mean, this was before Enneagram. She was, she was just blown
away by my self absorption, but she knew I was a kind person. It's like, and she did not understand. Enneagram would have been
very helpful back then. Sure. Beth: Sure. So, um, yeah. And so as you're kind of saying that. I am curio
us to kind of
like unpack a few things. So, and you've already done this work. So this isn't so much, uh, bringing it
to your attention as in like kind of summarizing, but if, if I miss anything,
let me know, but you know, as the four being very, can be very self absorbed
and focused on their emotions and it's. Because they're so big and they feel
so all encompassing and that no one understands and I also don't belong. And so I have to kind of deal with this
by myself or try to convince people t
o understand, but then they never do. And then it just perpetuates this problem. And so. But at the same time, so there's that
wounded part of our heart, right? The wounded child that
is like, no one gets me. No one understands me. I don't belong. I'm too much. I'm not enough. Um, and it really traps us in basically
isolation versus the beloved child, the beloved part of your heart that knows what
Christ has already done and accomplished for you, that he literally created you. With all the uniqu
eness and the
intricacies and how special you are creative and how much depth
you can have to reflect him in ways that are unique to you, right? So like Christ has great
depth and emotions. I mean, he was so emotional at
Gethsemane that he, and so much anxiety that he sweat blood. You know, and, and I, I've never
done that, you know, but he was able to be an authentic human. While God and fours can so quickly
resonate with people in their hard places and stick with them in it. Like a lot of pers
onality types, there's
some personality types that can go there, but they don't want to stay there. They want to like help the
person to like, just move on. But what I'm hearing that you're
saying with the work that you do. Is you are gifted naturally to not
only be there with them in their grief and in their space, but to
let them know you've been there too. And how you've been there. And that is such a beautiful
representation of Christ because he came to be with us to let
us know that we belo
ng to him. Does this kind of summarize
and paint a picture of. Of what this is saying to Gregory: well, I, I would have to
say yes, because when you said that about the Christ, like showing up
right in, in the midst of the heart and difficulty, um, so in my heart,
it's yes, that's what I long for. And I don't even know if I do
that adequately, of course, right. But yeah, that is, that is the, the
core of just a caveat on there is that there was a time when I had
big feelings, but didn't know it.
Um, I remember having a fight with
my daughter in the, in the kitchen and, and, and she's, she's an eight. So she's coming at me. Right. Right. And then I realized, wait, I've only
been home five minutes and everybody else in the household is angry at me. Why is that? Why is everybody in such a bad mood? Could it be? I'm in the bad mood. So I remember a time that I wasn't
aware of my emotions, which is, I mean, at least those negative emotions. I mean, on that day I was not, and then
I started
to explore and become aware. So that was a helpful thing. And one of the things
I also became aware of. Is that almost instinctively sometimes
I would, um, I would try to give advice too quickly in situations and I
think it was just a knee jerk reaction because I'm supposed to be a helper. But what I've discovered again with
the awareness is that, um, if I, I don't have to, and why am I doing that? Well, because I want to help
them right there, but then realizing, no, the helpfulness. Is to go a
head and sit there with them
and ache and maybe shed a tear for them. And then later on, even thinking
about them and just, you know, just being brokenhearted because
some people are in just horrid circumstances and they're so trapped. And that's, that's heartbreaking. Beth: Yeah. And when you agree that most people don't
want to go to those hard places or don't feel they could or should, or like you
said, like, no, I should be helpful. I should get them out of this, but don't
we all long for so
meone just to sit and listen to what we're experiencing
and our pain without the fixing part, like just someone to come alongside us. And that's what you're gifted at. I mean, it's. It's the natural bent of the four. And it's such a beautiful quality. Do you, do you sense that beautiful
quality or does the feeling inadequate and something missing? Does that somewhat take away of
the recognition of how um, Great. You are in that space Gregory: it. I'm going to say it's 50 50 now. No, but some day
s, because I do
have remembering that time of still feeling inadequate, but
over time and the experience. Of realizing, wow, I, I simply
just provided an incredible gift. Um, and, and I understand the logic of
it because I have experienced it myself. Um, my, my, my first friends,
my, my first friends were podcast people who were in this situation. I'd never ever heard. Of parenting, a child, uh, children from
trauma differently than normal parenting. And I remember it was a podcast episode
and i
t was introduced the idea that there's a, that traditional parenting
doesn't work with kids from trauma. And I'm going, wait, what? So, for the very first time, I felt seen
and, and I was told, you are not a bad person because you don't have the capacity
or the skills to promote healing in the life of a child with ICU level emotional. Trauma and injuries, you're not a bad
person because you don't know how to do this and because you don't have the
emotional capacity now, since that time, I've bui
lt up the emotional capacity
and the mental capacity and learn the skills and been through the fire. So. In my mind, I know what it feels like when
I show up for somebody who, who's there. I know. And when they say, I so
deeply appreciate this. I know that they're telling
the truth because yeah. Been there and they're
hopeless to hopeful. I know what that journey looks like. Beth: Yeah. And so as we, cause that's so beautiful. And as we kind of wrap up this,
this front part, I want to see. You h
ad said at the beginning that in
starting your kind of your coaching business, where you're having to ask
people to pay for your services versus getting paid and just doing the job,
you were kind of like, well, are people going to pay for those services? Do I have what it takes? But I think as you were just saying all
that stuff right here, the beautiful stuff you're saying, I'm hoping. And that's why I want to ask you, do
you see how what you give as a gift is the very thing people are needing?
And they're not only willing to pay, but
they're, they need that, that person, that coach, that, that guide that will sit
with them in the dark, hopeless spaces. To be their advocate, to be their support,
to be their, uh, uh, fellow journeyman. Does that make sense? Gregory: So, okay, you're inviting
me to go to my thinking brain. Yes, 100 percent that makes sense. Do you mind if I just push back a touch? Absolutely. So there is, but I long
for the world where. Where everybody just has access t
o that. Yeah. Oh. You know? Yeah. I do. I do. So that's in the back of my, that's
that extra little thing that just hangs in there going, uh, and I don't know
if it's, if it's, it's me fighting against it, but, but I do, I do. No. But I do know that that. I do believe and trust that I
have a gift to offer to people. Beth: Well, and so all my types
actually long for the Garden of Eden in their own way. So I long, yeah, I long for
peace and harmony, right? Like, like that's what I long for. And we
had it. It's almost like we can each taste that
part of the garden that we long for. And for the four, they long
for, for beauty, for depth. Um, And, and so in, in wholeness and for
everybody, yes, because we all had it. And so your longing for that is actually
a perfect representation of how God made you uniquely you to reflect
him because that's what he wants. And so you're only demonstrating
your heart's demonstrating the most beautiful one. I mean, not one, but there's many
beautiful aspect
s of God, but one of his beautiful aspects. If you didn't have that longing as a four. It would be surprising because I think
he put you here to have that longing because and it's right for you to have
that line because it's no longer here at the level that we should have it. And so there's this, this
rightness, this tension within you of the already, but not yet. Right? Like we already have his connection,
his beauty, his depth, because he came. And sacrificed himself for us, and
he's here with
us now, and yet it's not here completely, and it's the not
yet part that we should be longing for. We should be desiring, and we
need to bridge the gap for people. With the gifts that we have. So I'm really good at being a great
listener, not judgmental, bringing peace and harmony, mediating circumstances. I'm really good at that. But I do struggle in a lot
of the other areas that other types are really great at. And I would say even where you're
really great at, I can do it for a very small po
rtion of time. I long that I could do it more and better. But I am ultimately not created to do it
at such a beautiful level that you can and so I would push back and just say, I'm
glad you long for everyone to have it and that that's the tension within you that. You would rather them not have to pay,
that everyone can have access to this. I think it would be a, a tristy
for you not to have that longing. Does that make sense? Gregory: Oh, not only does it make
sense, but it was actually very, ve
ry beautiful and touched on something. I mean, you reframed that. So you reframed what I was thinking. And you put that within the context
of that is a longing and that is a good thing for you to have the
all the already and the not yet. Yes, of course you want that. And, and that's what God wants. God wants that also. Um, and that is a holy longing. Right. Given my current circumstances. Um, Keep longing for that. Actually, that's what drives me forward. Beth: Yeah, absolutely. Because you are
bringing that even though
you're one human and it's a bit by bit, it's still pushing back the fall in the
way that you were designed, where you're passionate, where you're gifted at. And that's what I think God has
called us in our professions to do is to push back the fall where we can. Um, ultimately he does the work, right? But he gives us the gift
to participate with him. Um, in the way that we are created. And so I, that's why I love that you
long for that because then it motivates you to a
ctually do the work, to push
back, to be the person that will sit with people in their despair, with
their hopelessness, um, because. Most personality types can't they don't
always talk about how we each have our bodybuilder muscles like the eights. They're really good at plowing a snow
path or like a path for us like a snowplow, you know, well, not all types
are the big diesel snowplow, right? You know, they can maybe
plow a little path. But so we have these like. Muscles, you know, in certain
categories
where we're like the bodybuilders in that area, but then we're, we have
atrophied muscles in other areas. So for you, you are really strong
in the emotional category and to sit with people for long periods of time. And they're suffering their grief, their
ups and their downs, and not always having to fix it, but just to be there. Um, But then you're going to
have atrophy in other categories. And so, yeah, we should work on
the atrophy muscles, but I think God really wants us to show u
p
where he created us to be our most, um, strong, useful, courageous,
what naturally flows out of us. And that's really just kind of what
I see is going on for you, though. The hard part is that you feel
for others, which is good, but you feel so much for others. It can also be. Um, something that can hinder
you from actually moving forward. It's that you find like sometimes
your, your great emotions are also the thing kind of like that
withdrawal piece, that thing that like the, the hook that p
ulls you back. Does that seem true for you? Gregory: Um, that my
emotions sometimes do that. Yeah. Beth: Or the longing is so great
and it feels like you can't do it. You can't bring it all
to everyone that it holds Gregory: you back. Sometimes the longing is so great that
I can barely stand it and I do have to withdraw, you know, sometimes that
that because the longing itself, I mean, being with people, it's not like,
Being with people who are hurting, I could just do that forever and for
alway
s, you know, it does take a toll. It's just, I guess I would say I, I
do, I just have more capacity to hold it for longer, but then eventually,
um, then eventually I do need it. It is too overwhelming. Um, and so I do have to withdraw. Yeah. And luckily nowadays I don't
have anybody demanding my time. So I can withdraw and I don't have
to, I don't have to show up as much. I've got, I have to show up
for my family, but, but I, but the draw, the energy draw
of showing up for my family is not as gr
eat as it once was. Yeah, no, that makes sense. Otherwise I would have been
totally moody and self absorbed. Beth: Um, yeah, so, and I love that part. So let's use that and let's
bring it into the backside of the guide sheet where we talk about. Enneagram paths. Yes. And so there are four boxes here and
the first box is about your stress path. So you moving to the average, the
unhealthy parts of two, cause the four is connected to two and in the
symbol and then the blind spot path. This is what
you're like when you're only
with your family, maybe a close friend, but this is, um, You know, you moving
in the average, the unhealthy parts of a type one, but then we move into the
growth path and it's the same path. So it's you moving to the type one, but
this is where the Holy spirit is really coming in and enabling you to live out
that beloved child part of your heart. And we'll, we'll nuance
all of these in a second. And then the last one, which is
the hardest one, because growth is hard
is the converging path. And this is where the four not only is. Healthy in their four space and
their one space, but now they're taking on some of the healthy
characteristics of the type two. So let's walk through each of these. So why don't you read what it's like
as a type four, when you take on some of the characteristics of the
average to the unhealthy two part. Gregory: Super stress path, the way
you think, feel, and behave when under stress type four moves toward average to
unhealthy type
two and defend your hurt feelings by withdrawing attention, become
over involved and clingy to win affection, create dependencies by manipulating
others to need them and become possessive and need closeness with others. Um, So in terms of that, I have, in my
experience, it's a slightly different flavor than that when I go to two. So for me, I, um. I can become over helpful and trying to
do and, and, and serving so much and just, I guess, over involved and things not
necessarily to cling or win a
ffection. What I've noticed myself is that I go
ahead and over serve everybody around me. So that at least for a period of
time, nobody is going to need me. And I just want to earn some respite
from everybody because I discover, and here's where I go, I get kind
of resentful is that if I go ahead and meet this child's need over and
over, and they ask for one more thing, and it's like, I'm grateful, um, And so
that, that's one of the things, but with my wife, I would definitely, um, sometimes
bec
ome over involved and clinging. So if she took a step back, I
would run towards her to go and. Do something to try and
manipulate her to come back. Sure, yeah. And do that. But then of course in good for fashion,
if she came and wanted to approach me and needed something for me, you
know, I might withdraw from her. So yeah, kinda the push pull. Oh, push pull .
Beth: Yeah. Um, no, that's great. And I love that you nuanced it for you
because these guide sheets, you know, we use, I use them with,
you know,
every type four, the first guide sheet. But it's unique to you and your experience
and the way, um, you go about it. And obviously the type two,
there's a plethora of things that you could have picked from, and I
love how you made sure that it fit you and how you experienced that. Um, okay, so let's move
into the blind spot Gregory: path. The way you behave around those with
whom you feel most secure type four moves toward average to unhealthy type
one focus on flaws, becoming more voc
al, judgmental, critical of others, and
visibly display your disappointment. Become impatient, picky, and controlling. Criticize yourself for personal
imperfections that leap out at you. Beth, I got to tell you, cause this is. Gold. I don't remember how many months
ago when I read this, um, I don't remember if it was in your book or,
or the guide sheet, but it blew my mind because, so I read this, right? And so it must've been last fall. Okay. Not, no, not this last fall, but
before that, no, it
was just last fall. We're watching football
August or September. That's where this must have come. And my, we're, I'm sitting with two of
my adult daughters and one son in law. I'm sitting in the big comfy chair. My oldest daughter is sitting on the
couch across the room with the dog. And I said something, I don't
remember what I said, but all of a sudden she goes, dad, are you telling
me the right way to pet the dog? And I had just read this, right? And I'm going, yes, yes, I am. And then my n
ext daughter,
she goes, Oh, that's nothing. He teaches, he tells me the
right way to give them treats. Beth: And I'm going,
it's such a sweet way. It's not like a big thing, right? It's not like, it's just. Right. But it was able to come to your attention. I love that. That's Gregory: so endearing. Oh, it was so wonderful. And I'm going, Oh my gosh. And then I said to my son, you know what,
I've discovered son that, that I can be perfectionistic when I'm with my family. And he rolls his eyes and
goes. Really? Never noticed that. Beth: And that's what's so
amazing about the blind spot path. That's why we call it the blind spot path. Because we because it's it's actually
the very things we really kind of. distaste about type that's outside us. So like for you, like when you see type
ones being so judgmental, the four is typically like, just let people be them. Like it doesn't be their unique selves
and, you know, very kind of, um, uh, embracing of all of the person. Right. But what we do
n't realize
is we actually do that same. style in our own family life, but we
don't even know it, but your son is like, uh, you didn't realize this and
that's how it is for our family all the time, but we just, it's so hard for us
to see until it's laid out like this. Oh yeah. And yeah, most people
are always like this. This is the one that like, Their eyes open
like, oh my gosh, I, yes, that's true. But I never would have said it, Gregory: you know? Yep. That was just amazing Beth: stuff. How h
as that, how has that
been then helpful in your relationships with your kids? Gregory: Um, One is several
levels on their part. One is acknowledging it and naming it. So they're willing to call me on it. But most importantly is that I'm now aware
of it and I recognize it sooner when I'm starting to go and I just go, Oh, nope. And I may end a sentence improperly
and just quit talking and it's awkward. And. And my son will say, what
were you going to say? I said, I was going down
perfectionistic p
ath. And neither one of us want me to do that. I love Beth: that. So you probably like, yep. Thanks. Gregory: Well, he does. And then he says, but I am curious. I said, no, let's not. Beth: Well, and that's a great
segue into the growth path because. The growth path, which is right next
to the blind spot path that we're talking about here on the screen is
going to the same number, but it's going to the healthy parts of type one. So we actually want you to embrace the
one, but we just want you to
be in a healthy space because it brings out the
best of a one, but through the lens. of a type four, right? So it's a mixture. So why don't you read that? Because ultimately, probably some
of the things that you were maybe wanting to say to your son in that
moment, probably would have come out not so healthy or helpful, but I bet
it could have been done in a healthy way and very beneficial to him too. So let's, you read that
and then let's explore that Gregory: as well. Growth path when the Hol
y Spirit enables
your growth type four moves toward healthy side of type one, become more emotionally
balanced, objective and principled embrace mundane tasks as opportunities to be a
good steward, responsible and organized, become more disciplined, productive,
focused on doing what is right. Beth: So with the scenario that you
were going to say to your son, which would have come out more critical,
what in it had wisdom in it or truth or rightness or nobility? Gregory: Well, where I can say on t
hat
first one, become more emotionally balanced, objective, and principled. So in this particular case, and this
has been, I've been able to repeat this numerous times through numerous
conversations, and that is that that emotionally balanced and objective and
principled aspect is I have been taught that if we, when I want to control my
son and want him to go down a certain path, because I It's better for him. It's better for people. He's around. It's better for me. It's just, it's just all bett
er and
it's a no brainer how much better it is. But what I recognize balanced,
objective and principled is that I've been taught that ambivalence
is real and ambivalence is okay. Yeah. And so I know what I've discovered is
by keeping my mouth shut and being open to bigger possibilities and open to the
spirit actually working on him, that whole idea of I need to fix my kid now, right? That panic, that fear based
thing, but trusting up somehow, some way it's going to be okay. So yeah. And what tha
t allows me to do is when
he says something ambivalent, where on the one hand, I really want to do this. On the other hand, obstacles to doing
that and how he doesn't want to do that. Now I can say, Oh yeah, I can see
why both of those things are true. Well, guess what? That gets hit. He feels comfortable with me and he's. He allows himself to continue to explore
that and I am safe with he, I don't, I'm, he's safe with me and so he feels like he
can continue to talk out loud and think through th
e paths that are ahead of him. Well, that's, wow, that's wonderful
because all of a sudden, yeah, go ahead. Beth: And that's. The four in you. I mean, that literally is because with
our kids, like that's the whole thing with the blind spot path is this other
part of us wants to like jump in because like you said, it's like, we kind of just
want to fix the problem and move on or like, you know, like we're, and we're
so geared to fixing problems, um, and not being bothered by our kids so much. Tha
t's like the less
healthy part of ourselves. But the beautiful part of the four
is that fours champion the person in their own growth path, like their
own journey, like them uncovering themselves and learning and growing. And so the one, the healthy part
of the one is enabling you to, um. Be that part, but also principle, Gregory: does that make sense? Oh, I think it was a
beautiful way to say that. That's, that is, okay. I wouldn't have seen it, but now
that you say it and connect that of, of I
'm going full on one principled
objective and then all of a sudden the healthy parts of my four of that
compassion of letting my son walk the journey that he's supposed to walk. Yeah, Beth: that's because I'm assuming
you do that with everybody else outside of the family. Pretty easily. Would that be right? Gregory: Well, let's say easier. Beth: Yeah, easier. It's more natural for you
as a four outside of the responsibilities of a parent. To sit with the next person and, and
to allow them to be
ambivalent, to allow them to kind of go through their
journey as you're supporting them, as you're bringing wisdom and insights
and guidance, but you're not as rocked to the core as we are as parents. But the fact that you're now
doing it with your son is. The most beautiful thing is that
most kids are like, they'll see their parents out and about doing what they're
really gifted at with everyone else. And they're like, why
don't I get that person? You're Gregory: giving him that. Wow. Yeah. Tha
nk you. Yeah. Beth: And so then let's go to
the converging path because, so when you're at this place. of growth paths, so going to the
healthy parts of one and you're using the healthy part of four, then the
hardest part, but the most beautiful part is bringing those two things and
the healthy part of two all together. That's why we call it the converging path. So why don't you go ahead and read that Gregory: one. As transformation takes place,
you can transcend to this level. Type 4 moves towa
rd
healthy side of type 2. Selflessly support and care for others
without needing attention on yourself. Express gratitude for what you possess
instead of longing for what is missing. Openly affirm the positive
qualities others possess. Beth: So what comes to mind with Gregory: that? That I don't go here as often. Beth: It's hard. Gregory: It's so hard. Um, one of the things that, but
awareness once again is the thing, is that there were several times this
weekend at the conference where I chose
, somebody's telling me, um, something
that's going on in their life, right? Mm hmm. And, I just want to go, barely go over
the line and let them know a little bit of something about me so to that will
hopefully prompt them to say, okay, this guy gets it, let's, I'm going to
keep talking because I recognize there were, there have been times when I've
gone a little bit too far and all of a sudden I'm starting to make it about me. And the story gets too long
is the difference there. So this weeken
d, I literally shortened
my end of the story and was aware of it and just consciously went
ahead and said, okay, just give them just enough to prompt them to talk. Right. And what happened? They kept talking and
it was lovely, right? They trusted me a little bit more. And I, now that's not, that
wasn't coming naturally, right? I, because I'm having to practice going
to that healthy side of two, but I'm pretty, I was pretty pleased that,
that I was number one, aware of it. Thank you. Thank you, E
nneagram. And thank you, you describing
this converging path. Um, and And therefore you might say, I
was able to actually show up for them in my full foreness and actually be
a blessing, be a healing force, be an instrument of God's peace in their life. Because I just, I was able to practice
a little bit of doing that, that Beth: convergent stuff. You are created uniquely you are created
to express and to bring about beauty and you are created and this is what's so
interesting and I truly try to
help people understand this is there's a spectrum of
being others focused and self focused. Usually I would say and. our life, but especially in the
Christian world, it's like, Oh, you shouldn't be so focused at all. You should only be others focused. So then like type fours and threes and
eights and sevens especially can be, uh, at times, um, unfortunately categorized
in this Self absorbed place, you know, for their own reasons and then all the
other types are like, Oh, but they're so selfless
or, you know, whatever self are
focused on others, but it's a spectrum like for me as a nine, I can get so others
focused that I am highly codependent and it is not healthy for me and others. I have got to learn how to
be more, um, in the middle. you know, where it's both a self
focused on the healthy things. Jesus was self focused. He took great care of himself. Um, but he also was others focused. And so that balance between the two,
and that's really what I'm hearing here is that you need to
be self focused. And you were really good at that in the
sense like that's a strength that you have, but where you were self focused
here was the recognition that you can have a tendency to take the conversation too
far into your domain and leave them out. And so you were self focused
enough to go, Oh, wait, that's not actually what my goal is. That's not helpful here, but I'll
give just enough to open the door for him to walk through, for him to
explore and to talk about his cell. And that help
ed him to navigate
whatever it is that he was doing. So yes, that was the
perfect bringing the one in. So you're being principled, you're
grounded, you're balanced, but enough of the four where you're able to. Share yourself, but enough
restraint to focus on him. Gregory: Yeah. Yeah. That's really cool. I appreciate you, uh, painting that
picture of, of what was going on. That's, that's very affirming. Beth: Yeah. And then, then, you know, that's,
what's so great is that you get. To do this over
and over and over again
with all of your coaching clients. Now, yes, life ebbs and flows. We're healthy. We're not as healthy, but ultimately God
has given you these parts and your healthy part for to really show up for people in. Such amazing and beautiful
and dynamic ways. And it's only our false thinking, our,
um, self doubts are limiting beliefs, head trash, whatever you want to call it
that we think is true, but hinders us. And actually that's the last part
of this guide sheet that I want
to cover is that we have this. We have many internal messages
and false messages, but this is one that really feels true to each
type and it really can derail us. So for you as a type four,
it's if I'm authentic and true to myself, then I'm okay. Does that feel kind of a natural,
uh, message that is floating in your mind, even if it's kind of
on low volume in the background? Gregory: Well, this is, this
is an area where I'm not very well developed in Enneagram yet. Okay. Um, I think I told the s
tory of some
time, well, I told the story of not being always aware of my emotions. Sure. Yeah. And so my brain has not. I don't, if I'm authentic and true
to myself that I'm okay and I am, I do not have awareness of that. I'm confident that it's true,
but I'm that first question. What exactly does it mean to be
authentic and true to yourself? Um, and how do you know when
you've arrived at this point? I'm going, yeah, that's a great question. Right. I haven't had it. When, when, what does
it mea
n to be authentic? And true to myself. Um, and I, yeah, I still don't know, Beth: right. And, but that's okay. So like for, for us as nines, um,
ours is if everyone else is good and okay, then I can be good and okay. Well, you're a dad, you know, that Yeah. People are not good and okay like
ever so that means a nine can never be good and okay And that's kind of
sad if it were actually true, right? I would have to live in a
constant state of I'm never okay. No one else is ever okay You know
and a
nd that's just not true. I can be okay, even if others aren't
okay That doesn't mean I'm like happy about it But I can be okay. I can be self regulated. I can be sober minded. I can move towards people and not have
their world all consumed with mine. I don't have to merge. I don't have to be codependent. Um, I don't have to be a doormat. And so But everything inside me
wants to say, no, I have to have everyone else peaceable and happy. Then I can be peaceable and happy. And it's just not true. A
nd so like for you, if I'm authentic
and true to myself, then I'm okay. And I, that's why I put these kinds of
contradictory questions to kind of prompt. Well, then for me, well, when
is it that everyone's okay? Like when, when is that actually. What does that look like? When does that happen? When can I actually rest or feel okay? And so I think these are
really good, great questions. And as you become more aware of this
statement and kind of listening for it in the background, cause sometimes
it's on, you know, low volume, sometimes it's blaring, but as you
become and maybe change the wording to fit, you know, how it shows up. In your world, that might actually
be beneficial for you to ask these prompting questions and kind of like
push back on it, not in a negative way, but in a self freeing way, like
I, I, I am going to be authentic. I mean, as a, for you are authentic,
but there's times that, you know what, you're going to have to show up and
maybe kind of towed the line of the cu
lture and that's not going to feel
great, but you're going to be okay. And it's going to happen. Um, does that make sense? What did that, what did Gregory: that hit? Um, so, and this is just like,
if, if this is almost just like a surface thing, but you, it's almost
like you just skated a trough across the, the surface of something. When you talk about, see, there
are certain situations that, okay, the longing for wholeness and
beauty and peace in the world. Um, so Beth: what, wait, put that, pu
t that in
this statement, say if I have wholeness, beauty and what was the other thing? Gregory: I don't remember. So we'll just go wholeness and beauty. Then I'm okay. If I have wholeness and beauty that
transforms those around me, then I'm okay. And here's what I meant by that. by mean by that. Yeah. Is you had mentioned that longing thing
for the world being at peace, beautiful and not, you know, let's face it. It's ugly sometimes. Um, and I, I do struggle. With just saying it's okay
where it
's at right now. Um, and I have to live in
this world that is not okay. Um, where children grow up in poverty
and abuse and And in homes where people are just trying to deal with their
stress and their trauma with addiction and cannot take care of the children,
they may love their children or the fiery passion, but they can't make
decisions to save their kids lives. Um, so there is a part of me that
wants to show up in such A state of wholeness and beauty and compassion
that, that everything cha
nges around. Okay. The serenity, no, the, um, prayer of St. Francis, make me an
instrument of your peace. My deep longing is to be such an
instrument of God's peace so that. It's transformative and the,
and the ripples, you know, go out and, and bring peace. I can't, I'm really beaten around the
bush on this one because this is a tough Beth: subject. Well, yeah. And you're also exploring it
kind of for the first time. So that's Gregory: great. Yeah. So, huh. Okay. So what is exactly, does it mea
n to
be authentic and true to yourself? Um, I want. I want to be, I don't want to be inadequate. I want to be so filled with beauty,
the wholeness, the compassion that it's transformative, that just showing up
changes the world in a positive way. And what that would, what that means. The other piece of the four that
I'm putting next to that is, let's face it, I am not beautiful
and powerful and, and whole and complete enough to make that happen. Beth: So that's another kind of false. Yeah. So an
other false. So that's because this
is a false statement. And then that's another false
statement that comes in to kind of prove or double down. Gregory: But I think you would also agree. If I change the angle and look
at it from a bigger, a different perspective, technically in my walk
with Jesus, literally all I have to do is be the seed That was sown. Right. And all I have to do is sow seeds of
beauty and compassion and wholeness. And it's God who gives the growth. The, that great Mark, Matth
ew 13
story of, of the sower, right? Technically. All I have to do is show up and
sow those seeds of love and peace and wholeness and completeness,
um, and beauty, and that's enough. And then I can just let it go
and trust that somehow, some way God's going to make it okay. Beth: Exactly. And that comes all the way back to
everything we've kind of talked about where you feel inadequate, something's
flawed, something's missing that other people have, but you don't. And yet you long to be, to give
the most. of yourself that is so beautiful,
compassionate, um, and can come alongside people that in some ways, in
a sense, you're kind of saying, so I can save them, which is a great desire. Like we want people to
be whole and to flourish. But what you just said at the end was. But I'm though God has given me
the gift to be there with people. He is their ultimate savior. I get to sow the seeds and he gets to do
the nurturing, the watering, the growing. And so it's this, it's
the both end, righ
t? It's you get to be imperfectly perfect
for the people you're serving, but God gets to be the perfect one that. Brings the salvation, the redemption,
the wholeness, the beauty that they need, and you get to let go of that
ultimate responsibility and literally just thrive in being how he created
you to be, which is special and unique. Gregory: So good. So good. Beth: Does this feel like if we kind of
bring this all back around where you're feeling maybe a little stuck in kind of
putting yoursel
f out there and needing to kind of bring in, you know, the money
to support yourself, that it is a gift to give of yourself, but also it's a gift for
you to receive their gift of payment to. Have the life, you know, just pay
the bills and all those things like God has given you this give
and take from others as a means to enjoy how he has created you to be Gregory: and to trust that
it very well may be that God. Is going to provide families with
the resources they need right so that they can, um
, request that I
come walk alongside them, right? So that is ultimately a trust
in God for daily bread, right? Is that I may have a picture in my mind of
how I want God to provide my daily bread. But I'm not in charge of that. Am I Beth: right? And it's a form of trust. It's a form of dependence on
him to see him provide, not just for yourself, but for them too. And all of us, when we quote
unquote, put skin in the game, we actually show up and we transform
more than if it's just given to us. An
d that could be the
very way that God has. These people that you're going
to be working with to grow. Um, now it's noble and it's wonderful
that you would love for like money just to pour from the sky and you could just
serve all, all day long, but God has also said in this season and what I want you
to do, this is how it needs to happen. And. And so you get to actually be whole,
you get to actually experience beauty and compassion in a way
that isn't necessarily the way you would choose it, but
it's actually
going to be the best thing for you. And that Gregory: in, in this day, in
this time, in this space, this is the way I get provided. Beth: And it's Gregory: beautiful. And it, it is beautiful. Beth: I hope that this has been
helpful, kind of bringing it all around and, and kind of seeing
how beautiful God has created you. And uniquely he is put these different
gifts and talents in you so that you can and get to show up in the
people that you're serving, which are in such need of wh
at you have to
offer your experience, your sorrow, your grief that you've already
gone through and worked so hard at. They need you. And God is giving you that opportunity. I just think, wow, what a blessing
and just how beautiful it is. And I'm just really, really excited
for how much you have grown, the awareness you have implementing it,
not just in your life outside of home, but, but to implement it at home for
most people, that's a whole new level. And. It's exciting to hear how it's alread
y
reshaping your dynamics with your kids. So I just say kudos to the work
that you're doing and keep going. Gregory: Thank you. This is, this has been a lovely
journey, this hour together of, of how the pieces have all been
weaved together, woven together. That's this, this has been, this
has been a delightful experience. Beth: Well, thank you, Greg, for just
being here, being authentic, being real. You'll have to give me
some updates and emails. Like I can't wait to hear what God does
for you a
nd those that you get to bless. So be sure to send me the updates. Okie Gregory: doke. All right. Thanks. I can do that. Thank you. Beth: thank you so much for
spending time with me today. I hope today's session really
got to show you a positive change in someone's life when using the
Enneagram in a really good way. And as always remember the Enneagram
reveals your need for Jesus, not your need to work harder because
it's the gospel that transforms us. Take care. And I'll see you in the next epi
sode.
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