Hollywood Stylist Roundtable: Image Makers to Mega-Stars Kristen Stewart, Zendaya & More! | THR

- Let me just be 100% transparent. So, when I (laughs) - Sit up, sit up! - [Jason] When I (laughing) (upbeat music) - You actually lose money during awards season. I remember years ago, talking to a huge stylist, who sat there and said, "I am in the hole, $25,000 from the last three months." - Bloggers are now in the mix, where 10 years ago, they weren't even here. So they're wearing things. There's more actors, or people in Hollywood, or the music industry, than I think there ever were. There's

reality stars. So, everything's being spread super thin. - You got the dress, everything's done. And then, a boyfriend will come and say, - Ooh, ooh, ohh! (laughing) - That's the thing, - I don't like anybody in the room! (laughing) (upbeat music) - [Booth] Are we good? - [Assistant] Ready to go. - [Booth] Thank you! Hi everyone, welcome to the first ever Stylist Roundtable at the Hollywood Reporter. I wanna introduce all of our esteemed stylists. Jason Bolend, Ilaria Urbinati, Tara Swennen, Je

anne Yang, and Law Roach. So I wanted to just start and ask, What's the biggest misconception do you think about what stylists do? - Just shop. (laughter) I just shop - They think we just show up and put clothes on people, like we snap our fingers, and there's our favorite looks, and we have them, and we put them on people. - We essentially, we can't wear heals during the day, we can't wear our nice clothes. And everyone's like, "Well, you guys are stylists. "You guys should always be on point."

Well, no, we're literally, you know. You get dirty - [Ilaria] We're here to work. - You get, I mean it. The running joke is that we all run around in sweatpants, essentially, to get it done. And then, we attempt to clean up. - So that's why athleisure is in. - Yeah. - That's the best thing that ever happened to us. - That's exactly. We're the ones who directly had it happen. I mean - It's not an accident. - The reason that sneakers are very cool right now is truly because all of us, I mean, exc

ept for none of us are wearing them. (laughter) - We cleaned up! (laughs) - So, what was - I wear sneakers. - Alright, alright - The truth comes out! - I'm Sorry. (laughter) - So, who was the very first client that you got paid to style? - [Jason] Gabrielle Union, but it was a complete accident. She's one of my best friends, and I used to have a store in SoHo, in New York, and she was like, "I want you to come to Art Basel, "I want you to come to Art Basel. "And, just bring something from your s

tore." I was like, "Okay." And then she was like, "Here, they gave me a shopping budget. "Here, I'm paying for you for that." And that was my first paying styling gig. - Mine was Lindsay Lohan. - What? - [Jason] Word! - [Booth] That's amazing! - [Tara] A billion years ago. - [Jason] Word! - [Booth] How did that happen? - [Tara] Well, I used to work with Rachel Zoe, and so we had traveled a lot, a bunch together. And, she had a Proactive commercial that Rachel was unavailable - [Booth] The acne t

reatment? - Yes, the acne treatment. (laughs) And so, she asked me if I could do it. So, that was my first paying gig. - Mine was, like Brendan Fraser. And I was such a huge School Ties fan when I was young, like Encino Man, I was so excited. - [Booth] Were you nervous? - It all went wrong! (laughter) It was a mess! But I learned a lot, that it was everything that you could do wrong did wrong. (laughs) But I've learned since, obviously. - [Booth] Yeah. - Hopefully. - [Booth] How bout you Jeanne?

- My first client was Keanu, I think. I did the entire cast - [Booth] No big deal. Of The Matrix. - [Law] Casual, Jeanne! - [Jeanne] And it was because, Warner Brothers, they wanted to do a whole bunch of photo shoots, and they said, "Look, this is a different way "of platforming movies. "We're gonna have him go for two months. "So, he's gonna need a whole bunch of clothing." And, I don't think people realize, I mean, he really knew clothing. He was the one who taught me about neapolitan design

ers, and Kiton, and Fiorelli, and like proper stitching, - [Booth] Keanu Reeves? - Keanu was the one. And it was like, Oh, and wow! These are all Arnez, and this is what proper stitching involves when you're making a proper lapel, So he was the first person, really that I and it was kinda the beginning of real, celebrity styling, I guess. - 'Cause it was a press tour, right, a two month press tour? - It was a two month press tour, and then, shortly thereafter, it was like "Oceans," I think, yeah

. - What about you, Law, who was the first person you styled? - The first person I styled that I got paid for was and R&B singer named K.Michelle. I actually got put on a retainer. And it was, like $12,000 a month. And I was like, "Yes! (laughter) I am successful! Me, I feel like you're never really what you think you are until you get paid for it, so I had a lot of "I'm a stylist, I'm a stylist." But when I got the first check, I really felt like this is my profession, and this is what I'm supp

osed to do. - I'm curious how you feel about criticism of what your clients wear, and if you take it personally. - Well, my core clients, Zendaya and Celine Dione, we do things for us, you know? I don't want everyone to love my work. I like to tell a story. And I like for people to love it, and hate it. But what you will do, either way, you will talk about it. So, for me, I get great pleasure to knowing that my work has become the center of conversations. And conversations that bring people toge

ther. Because, Celine Dion over the summer, like, everywhere I went in the world, people were like, " I was at my job, "and we were at the water cooler. "And we were arguing about this look." (laughter) That just brought me so pleasure, because it's two people that probably wouldn't have spoken to each other, and now they have this topic of conversation, and it's all about fashion. - You know, but people don't always realize all that goes into it. And, sort of the kinds of last minute things tha

t can go wrong, that change a decision - Or last-minute phone calls that I'm deciding to attend something. - Taraji, right? - Yes. - For the Oscars - I, two days. - I had somebody, Friday night, "I'm flying in on Saturday. "Can you meet me and" - That's been every awards I've ever done. - Yeah, it happens all the time. - Let me tell you why this happens to you guys. Because you're good. (laughter) It only happens to the good ones, because we've trained our clients to feel that they're worthy - t

o know we'll work it out - It's okay - and it's okay - It's a blessing and a curse though. - [Law] Right, it's a blessing and a curse. - It's a blessing and a curse - You're too fucking good! (laughter) You're too good! - My phone call is like, "Hey, going to the Oscars, call you right back." What? Follow-up text, "Hahaha, laugh out loud." "No, I'll see you Friday." (laughs) - [Booth] How do you pull it off? How did you pull it off with Taraji? - You just do it. - You have no choice! - It is wha

t it is. I mean, I'm knocking on wood that she is pure magic, and she is the nicest human on the planet. It is literally, "This is yours, Jason. "This is yours, Ashunta, this is yours, Tim." And that is it. She shows up to fittings, she puts it on, and she is like. If she does her thing, and she starts talkin to herself in the mirror, it's done! That is it! And she's like, "And I'm done!" And that's literally how it happened. - [Booth] What does she say to herself in the mirror? - Um, well, I me

an (laughter) She literally, well, there's a couple of things. "Oh, this is a queen moment, honey. "This is a queen moment! (laughter) "The bitches are never gonna feed, honey!" Like, it's all of that, and it's games, and then she starts doing her posing. But, throughout all the stress, that particular moment, when you're in - There's so many more politics as well, by the way, so I wonder it's interesting to me that there has never been a styling competition reality show. And a lot of it is beca

use, 90% of what we deal with are external factors. Where a manager, an agent, somebody else, a boyfriend, a mother - Designers - Designers, got the dress, everything's done, and then, a boyfriend will come and say, - Ooh, ooh, ooh. (laughter) - I think that's the thing, too. - I've had that happen to me. - I don't like anybody in the room. - When I dress men, sometimes the wife will come in - But, I think even just for the general public, too. People will forget that a lot of designers, they do

n't want to dress one of your clients. I might have someone who's a little bit too edgy for this brand, - or they're too up and coming and I'll call for three years - Oh, I don't play that game. That game I don't play - I remember with Kristen Stewart, I called Lanvin, for seven years - What? - Every single two months, being like, "Yo." She was young, she was a baby. And they said, "Listen, our demo to sell these clothes, "is closer to the 30's, so she's not what we want quite yet." Every two mo

nths, "Are we ready yet? "Are we ready yet?" Can we please try - She had a birthday. - Come on, and then finally, it was like the clouds opened up, and the sun shone, and of course we got it, and she was like, "Meh!" (laughs) - See I'm the total opposite. And I've had this conversation with Ji Yang before. It was just like, "If you say no to me at the beginning, "no is forever for me." - Really? - So, I am notorious for using the exact same email, "Unfortunately, "we would like to pass." So what

I do, is I go back, - [Law] I do the same thing! - And I resend that. (laughing) "Unfortunately, we pass." - I do the same thing! - And this is my thing, this is one thing that drives me insane. I don't really know if it's the design houses, more than the PR people. Because you have these girls and guys who sit there, and just because that is not something you watch on television, it's not important to you. - [Tara] is funny how personal it is - It is so personal. - [Tara] 'Cause you'll have so

me random one on some random show, that you're like, "They would never loan to this person." And then, it turns out the designer's a big fan of that show. (laughter) - [Jason] It's so bizarre! - I will save having worked, I come from a retail background, I've worked PR, I've worked like every aspect, and I do understand it a little bit. - [Jason] I don't. - I understand it's a brand, you have a certain image. - [Jason] I don't understand it at all. I don't understand at all. When it comes down t

o dollars and cents, and what is keeping these businesses afloat, it is not the people who are normally the PR people, it's not the person who looks like that PR person, it's someone who looks completely opposite. And you're saying "No" to that person. And so it goes really deep. - So are you talking about diversity? - I think diversity is not it, it's called inclusion. Diversity is like, "Whatever," at this point. - So, do you think - [Jason] It's all about inclusion. - There's enough inclusion

, as far - Absolutely not. - [Booth] No, okay. So, you think that fashion brands are not being inclusive enough in who they're willing to loan to? - [Jason] I say "Yes," and also I really believe it's so simple. I think it goes down to the PR team. - But it's hard for us to go to them and say - [Ilaria] I totally agree. I think if you're Gucci, and you have, like five runway-worthy dresses that season, and maybe you wanna save them for the big moment, and I get that. And I do understand that as

a brand, you do have a certain image that you're trying to give off. - I think - And not everybody fits that image. I'll say this: I built my career, and I built Zendaya's career on not using any big brands at all. - Boom! - Hmm, well, there you go. - [Law] Because, in the beginning, they wouldn't touch her. - Pass, pass, pass - [Law] They wouldn't dress her, they wouldn't dress her. So, Zendaya made it to the cover of Vogue. She has never worn Valentino, she has never worn Gucci, she has never

worn Chanel. She only wore Dolce when she got a Dolce camplaign. - She always looks incredible. - [Law] We built that girl's career, and my career, using brands, smaller brands, and emerging designers. To prove a point that it can happen. - Which I think is awesome! - [Law] It is awesome! - It's awesome, but he also wants options. - It's just frustrating, is what we're saying. - Let me finish, because what it is, it's a big "Fuck you," because we all know the PR, they want to bring someone to yo

u because "Oh, she can get her in Valentino," but what I wanted to prove, is that she doesn't have to be in Valentino to become a fashion girl. Now, I love Katie, and I love Valentino, but, for a long time, they all said no to her. And this is a girl who's six feet tall, a size zero, gorgeous, can eat everybody else on a carpet. Like, nobody goes on a carpet and does what this girl does, and she's been doing this since she was 14. So, now that everybody wants to dress her, I go back and I say, "

Not this season." - [Jason] No, thank you. Listen, - [Tara] Here's the thing. - I understand both sides, I get both sides. - But, then you get in our shoes, and you get to the level we are. We go to Paris, and we go to the shows, and we go to these parties, and you see the designers, and they say, "I love her!" - Why come I never have? (laughter) That is my story all the time! - That is so true! - Why have I never dressed her? - My stories like, "We want her!" - Sometimes, they need to build tha

t relationship, though. That's the first thing I tell my clients. Go to the luncheons, go to the shows. - I'm the old OG, of the group. And I have to say that in terms of a lot of the designers, there's designers that I have worked with for years. That once in a while, will say no to me I mean, look, it doesn't matter if I have the biggest A-list star in the world, it's like, "It's not a match." Part of me knows, "You know, that's not right for that person anyway." It's a testament to you, that

you're able to work around it. The constraints of things, to a certain extent, you either rise above it, or you're crushed by it, right? You rose above it. Look, when you're new to the business, and they sit there, and they see your eye, they'll go, "Hey, you know what, he knows what he's doing, "or she knows what she's doing, you know this instance, I'm gonna give that person a chance." And the fact is, I know with Brooke, she saw the vision in you, and was like, "Oh, my god, you know what?" -

[Jason] Brooke is the one. - There's certain people, like a smaller PR firm, will go, "Oh, okay, wait, you know what, "that guy has got an idea," or "She really does have a vision." - For the devil's advocate of it all, too. You forget that, like, now, people are doing street styles. So, those "One samples," they're all going to the airport on a Jenner, and it's game over! - [Jeanne] True, well that's true. - And then, social media, where the bloggers are now in the mix, where ten years ago they

weren't even here, so, they're wearing things. There's more actors, or people in Hollywood, or the music industry than I think there ever were, - Everyone's going to the opening of everything. - There's reality stars, so everything's being spread super thin. So, from our perspective, it gets very frustrating when you have teams of people coming with a client, and in saying, "Where's my Dolce?" And you're like, "Dude! "You don't even know what you're talking about! "Give me a minute! "You know t

hat dress, it's in Vogue. "I called, do you think I didn't call it in?" - [Jeanne] No, no, no. But even still, when they say that to you, I think, "Why would you ever think you were a Dolce person? "That is so not you!" - Well, true. - To play devil's advocate on the other side, A lot of people who are watching this might say, "Why don't they just buy the clothes?" These are movie stars. - I'll get on board with that argument! (laughter) - Can I say the one thing? There are clients that I've wor

ked with in the beginning, where I said, "Look, let's go to Nordstrom's Rack, "let's go to Century 21." You're gonna buy some, and borrow some. Because, you need to develop that look. - Profile, you gotta create a profile. - You need to look amazing on the red carpet. - [Tara] Or Albright - And then, all of a sudden or Albright, or Ruby, or whatever it is. You say, look, "Borrow, rent," and you say, "Look, this is who this person is. "This is who we've established. "We've created this idea of wh

o that person is." And then, all of a sudden, it's like, oh, my gosh! - So why don't they buy, though, if they can't get something? - Well, that can come back to bite you in the ass, too. - If it's in the stores, that's a little bit of a problem. 'Cause, then, anybody can wear it. And then, they do the whole, like "Who wore it best?" Which, I also call "bullshit" on that, because I'm like, "Really, two people can't wear the same fucking dress?" I think that - That's another way I built my career

, though. I would only put Zendaya in things that everybody else had worn to get her to - To match up. - Look how much better she wore it! (laughs) - I'm like, "Literally, she's 16 years old! "She's six feet, who's gonna wear it better than her?" So, I would literally go to the showrooms, and they would say, "Law, someone already wore that," or "such and such wore that." I was like, "If you don't mind, I don't mind." And so, what happened, is she begins press off of who wore it better, and she w

ould always wear it better. So, it was those things. Because, I didn't come from anyone's lineage, you know. Unfortunately, I didn't have a mentor, I was never anyone's assistant, I was never an intern. So, when I came to L.A., I had to figure it out. And, so I - Yeah, I'm the same way. - [Law] And so, what I heard really quickly, I was like, "This game is about press." So, that's pretty good. - So, this is the thing though. When you do have certain people, and they're starting out, the one thin

g I, to a certain extent, want to explain to a young, new client, I'll say, "Please, go out there, and let's buy a few things," when you can, because a lot of them aren't necessarily being paid. Everybody thinks that actors have lots of money. They don't have tons of money. But, it's about getting some smart pieces here and there, and then developing their style. Because, for me, when I first started working with Kumail, he literally showed up, right before the Emmys, "Hey, I just did this movie

, we're hoping it's gonna get into Sundance. - [Booth] The Big Sick, right? - [Tara] And, I think it might do well. - Cut to. - Correct! - You start off, and you cut to - The Oscars - Cut to the Oscars, but you know, even still, I think that you don't get on the best dressed list overnight. You really won't, unless you develop. You see the long game, and you need to go ahead. It is, in turn. I mean, if we were to be here, the way that we're all here, right here, on this round table. One of the t

hings that I would want to convey to young actors is that, Develop a trust in us, let us go in for a long game. Don't have us just for a few red carpet events. Let us have the opportunity to develop a relationship. We can't just do this speed dating thing. It doesn't work. - So, I wanna ask about men. Ilaria, you've spoken about this, a little bit. Do you think men get more of a pass on the red carpet, as far as how they're judged? - Yeah, I just did an interview about this. Basically, I find th

at, with men, if they're not well dressed, they just don't run them. And if they're well dressed, they get, GQ Best Dressed, or this best dressed, or they get run. Versus women, I do find get attacked, and on worst dressed lists, and they get picked apart, and they get nit-picked at, and all this stuff. And I just think it's an interesting standard. And I think that media outlets could take a page out of the men's, which is just like, run it if you like it. If you don't like it, maybe just leave

it out. I don't know, I think it's crazy this idea that we're doing this whole "TimesUp" thing, and talking about the way we treat women versus men, but then somehow no one's talking about how it's okay that we just tear these women to shreds in the media because someone doesn't like their dress, or they think they look bad. Or, just like shaming them into wearing something. And honestly, I even had an issue with the fact that there was a couple people who didn't wear black to the Globes, and p

eople were like, so shaming them on social media, and on blogs, and Instagram, and whatever. And I was like, "Wait a minute, that goes against "everything that we're doing here, "which is to empower women, not to tear them down." And, you know, maybe that person, maybe they felt like wearing red said more. You know, who knows, maybe she didn't get the memo. By the way, I ran in to a couple people at Oscar parties, and Golden Globes parties, who were like, "I found out right "as I was walking in

the door. "Luckily, I changed last minute!" It's this idea that you're going to get attacked if you, I don't like that. And I don't think men - It's bullying. It's all bullying. - It's bullying! - I think we've created this - And men don't get bullied in that way. - This call-out culture, you know, this call-out culture, where we're just attacking people, even when we're supposed, like you said, it's supposed to be something that's uplifting, - I always say, "You haven't made it, until you've ma

de it on the worst dressed list." (laughter) - But this idea that I do think men don't get picked apart that way. No one's calling any guys. - Can I tell you the one thing that I think has been the most exciting thing, is that growing up, when I looked at magazines, there was only one girl, one specific hair color, one specific style, and I think it's funny that I've been hearing people ripping apart how stylists have supposedly ruined the red carpet, right? Well, if anything, for me, what's nic

e. One thing that's really nice for me, is I feel like, "Wow, for the first time, "we see people of all sizes, of all colors, of all shapes." And you can go ahead and identify, and say, "Oh, that person? "I love her city street style!" Or, "I love her wild, fierce flair!" Or, "I love his ability to peacock!" That to me is what really makes it. So you're right, I think it is really, incredibly unfair that men are just, "You made it, you're on the best dressed." - And I also think - Women, you get

both, or maybe three different options. It's like, "What was she thinking?" - And men dressed really boring for many years. And now, I think men are really going out of the box, in a way - [Booth] Your client, Armie Hammer, who wore a red tuxedo - [Ilaria] Yeah, wore the red velvet tux to the Oscars, and things like that, and they're getting praised. Because people are just so excited to see men finally get creative and try. - But we don't have any otpions. - We don't. (laughter drowns out conv

ersation) - And with men, as long as the tailoring is impeccable, it's great! - So, people are just so excited to se men wearing color, and doing something different, that they're praising them, versus, I think, when women take risks a lot of the time. - They get eviscerated! - Somebody didn't like it, no matter what they wear, someone loved it, somebody didn't. And I think that has to stop. That's so crazy that that's still happening. - A lot of publications have dropped their worst dressed lis

ts, and things like that. And I think, to your point, there has been more inclusion. And even, Jason, I wanted to ask you about your client, Ava DuVeray, a huge director, Wrinkle in Time, this female director is becoming a style icon. You know, someone who is normally behind the scenes. How have you seen that happen? - Before you answer, can I just say, I am obsessed with what you do with her? - [Tara] Me too! I wanna wear everything she - I love when someone creates this point of view for their

clients, and even if it's not on her, when I see it, I'm like "oh, my god, "Jason should put that on Ava!" It is - [Tara] Point of view! That's exactly - [Law] Beautiful. - [Tara] That's it. Point of view! - Oh my god, that means a lot! Ava is a force. She is a force, and she is the voice of now. And, to be a part of her journey, I mean, I coming off of doing the director Ryan Coogler, who just did Black Panther, and now, I'm going in to another director, like Ava. What people don't know is lik

e, she's so clear on her style point of view, and it was this one note for a really long time. But, you kinda just start doing things, and sneaking it in. - Big sleeves. - Yeah, it's like, sneaking it in. Ava has the most amazing body, and she's tall, everything is just so proportionate. It all makes sense. And, now, this whole run has been Armani Prive. And I've pushed the envelope, and I constantly say no to people who now, who want to be a part of her. Ava is not the "normal" size that we see

. She goes from The Row to Prada. I mean, it's all custom. That is my idea with Ava, it's like we have to show everyone that they make this stuff. The girls, the people who actually buy The Row do not look like those girls. That consumer is not that, the consumer looks like Ava. So, I'm so happy that The Row girls get that. - I think it's resonating with a lot of people. - I mean, she's like, it's amazing! - She's at that age, like a lot of things are finally starting to be - [Jason] To turn aro

und. - The age is a big one, because usually the women who can afford those clothes are older. - That's why I never understood the designers' obsession with the millennials. I'm like, "They're not buying these clothes!" (laughter) - In fact, you know what, there's quite a few magazines that have done studies, and the stores are realizing, most of those kids, and my daughters, they like their $9.99 Hanes sweatshirts. - [Ilaria] Sure they're at Top Shop. - They do not care about, or like a $5 tee-

shirt. They don't care about the designer things. When I'm in the stores, who do I see? Women over 45, men over 45. - That's part of the fashion issue right now, when you really, really think about it. These big, big brands, the Gucci, the Vitan, the Chanel, the Dior, all those things like that. You think of these other brands like Alife, Supreme, Noah, who have literally blocked it out, and that's where the money is made. Like, the kids don't care, they want that part of the world. - That's tru

e, and so, we've just come off of award season. How do you develop a strategy for a client's entire award season look? - Well, I think for me, I don't like to have a lot of people involved. (laughter) I don't want to have anybody involved, if possible, just what I think. I try to make it really organic, and try to figure out who that client is, and not change them, but just elevate, if I can. This is my first time I did a complete award season, and it's a lot of work! (laughter) - So, let's talk

about Mary J. Blige. She's one of your clients. And she comes from the music industry. Was there any thought, of "Oh, now we have to transition her "into being this, like Hollywood red carpet star?" - Yeah, you know, in that first initial meeting, that was my mindset, to introduce the world to Mary the actress, because we're so familiar with Mary the singer, and Mary the icon from the music side. And then, when I met her, and kind of, not schooled, but Mary was very much, "I like what I like,"

you know what I mean. So, I had to figure out clever ways to introduce things that were still her, but she didn't know it was her yet. What people don't understand about this job, maybe, guys, you can agree with me, is that it's more cerebral than anything else. It's not about the dress. It's about everything else that leads up to the dress, or a suit, in your case. But, it's not abut that, it's about the psychology of it. And, to create that synergy, and that chemistry with the client, where th

ey trust you. Because, how we live now, everything is about image. We see a person's image before we even hear them speak in some cases now. For me, getting into the psychology of it is the most important thing. - [Booth] Did you have to talk her into wearing the wing motif on her (laughs) - [Law] No, she loved that one I had to talk her into wearing the mint green Eli Saab. Because, that was a color, and a silhouette that she had never done,. And, actually, that was my breaking point. Because,

she went back and forth, and I just finally said, "Just trust me." And she did, she's like "I'll trust you." And the reviews she got, and the complements she got. She actually went to another show, and people were still taking about that dress, and she was like, "Okay, okay, okay, you're right. "From now on, I'll listen.' - And which awards was that for? - That was the one that was in, shit. There's been so many! (laughter) The Palm Springs one. - Oh, yeah, Palm Springs, yeah. So that was one of

the kick-offs, yeah. And I noticed that she almost developed like a signature silhouette throughout the season. That she has kind of like, a little off-the-shoulder kind of action. How do you describe that silhouette? - You know what happened was, and even some of the customs that we did, didn't start out that way. But, what I noticed, and again, going back to the psychology and the psyche of it, every single time we would pull the shoulder down, her posture would change. So, I figured out, thi

s is her comfort zone. This is what makes her feel beautiful. So, anytime we would get opportunity to show this, she's more receptive to it. So, that was just me getting non-verbal cues. Putting her in, doing fittings. So, after that, everything became off-the-shoulder. Everything became, I love to call this "the pretty parts." (laughter) - And what about you, Tara? You had Allison Janney all through awards season. How did you develop a strategy to make her into a fashion person? I think you and

I spoke, and she wasn't necessarily a fashion person in the beginning, but, by the end, at the Oscars, and she was in that red dress, with those amazing sleeves, she was all diva. - Thank you. (laughter) - [Ilaria] She looked amazing! - Thank you. Well, I think it's the same thing, you know. We only started working together just prior to award season starting. And so, it was about developing a trusting relationship, and just sort of pushing her a little bit, at every single event, every single

award show. And just nudging her in a different direction. For the I, Tonya press run, I think we did something like 55 outfits by the end, it was insane. So, you wanted to create a little bit of diversity, we didn't want to repeat too many colors, or too many patterns, or shapes, or what have you. So, it was really kind of fun. She also is, basically, over six feet, so we can really play with her, just cause she's a fashion stylist's muse. If you take a look at it, it was progressively getting

a little bit bolder, and a little bit bolder as we went. And, it was great, because, when a client entrusts you with that, and they know that you can continuously say, "Listen, I know it's something you've never done, "but they're gonna appreciate this in Europe." or, this is something working with the Time's Up movement, for instance, when we were dealing with the all black situation at the Globes. And for a moment, it was like, "Can we put a little white?" You know her Mario Dice dress had lit

tle bits of white beading, and she was very fearful, in the beginning, that there might be too much white. And, it was one of those things, where we called around, and I probably emailed some of you guys. - We're on a big group thread! - And said, "Like, do we think this is okay?" And, finally, I said, "You know what, I don't even care. "The whole point of this is "for all of us to band together, and I don't want that to impede any of our creativity. "So, let's do it, and let's do it." And it so

rt of was the one thing that set it apart from a lot of black dresses, which was great. And then, again, same thing at the Baftas, where similarly, she had sort of this big, off-white piece. We said we wanna do something a little bit more dramatic, and she was willing to do it. - Do you think that a style strategy can make a difference when it comes to academy voters, or when it comes to a campaign? - I don't know, I'm sure it affects it, somehow. - [Ilaria] With attention - Yeah, it's attention

. It was beautiful to watch her bloom through it. In the beginning, not a lot of people had seen I, Tonya. A lot of people were like, "We love her, "but we haven't seen the performance." - Favorite movie , by the way. (laughter) - [Tara] It was good. By the end, even convincing designers. I sort of was like, from the get go, I was like, "This woman has it." As she sort of swept every award through the season, it finally opened more doors to designers. And I said, "You guys, you gotta trust me on

this one. "It's going down." - I think people don't realize that, too. How much of a push-pull it is with the design houses, right? I mean, is that true for all of you, as far as, really you have to have a campaign with them as well to get? - That's what I was going to say earlier when you asked about misconceptions. I do think people think like, "Oh, this is a dress I think is the best dress, "and let me get that dress." And it really has almost nothing to do with which dress you think is the

best dress, because it's like, "Can you get that dress? "Is that dress available? "Do they want to loan to you? "If they do, is it available?" Maybe it's at Vogue, or maybe it's in sales. Sales is the worst. - [Jason] I hate sales! - Sales is the worst! - Can I just say, seriously, look. As somebody who was a designer, the one thing I have to say, is look I have to tell you. First of all, I was eviscerated some time ago. Because, this misconception really bothers me. That designers have racks an

d racks of clothing in all sizes. That sample, - [Tara] They don't - We know that - [Ilaria] We understand - It's one thing, no, no, no I know you guys know. We all know, I mean we're are aware of it. I think, sometimes celebrities will come in, and think, "Oh, well, you've just got racks of clothing." Well, that sample, when it's not there for sales, it doesn't matter how much publicity that dress got. The fact is, that then needs to go for sales, because you really - [Ilaria] The point of the

press is to get sales - to get sales on that dress, and it's really difficult, because a lot of times, you only have it in one size. Because, you only have the money. - I don't understand why designers don't make two samples. - Because it's expensive! - It's so expensive! Okay, just so you know - [Ilaria] and a sample size is - the average going rate. Like, maybe this pant costs only, eventually $300 to make, but as a sample, it would run me at least $3,000 to $7,000 to make that sample. Because

the twall - [Jason] Because you're not buying in bulk - costs so much more. 'Cause you're going through, you're wasting. You're literally sitting in the room with a sample maker, several different iterations of it. So, it costs you a lot to eventually make it. And when you have that - [Ilaria] So people don't understand - True, but once you get through the process of making the pattern, and all the things that go up into the making a sample, it couldn't cost that much more to produce one more.

- It does - [Ilaria] It does! - I have to tell you - The reason it's cheap to produce is because you're doing it mass marketing for stores, but by that time, it's in stores, and then you can't put it on somebody, 'cause then anybody can buy it. - So the misconception is that there's only one of these garments to go around. - The misconception is that people don't understand that the item that you see go down the runway is it. So that, - In the world! - One dress, in the world, is what they have

to share for their sales, when they have a sales with Barneys, and Barneys is like, "That's what we're buying." Trunk shows, editorials, so if it's going to Vogue, or Elle, or Interview, or whoever, that's the same one. So, the chances of that dress being available at the time that you need it, and then they have to want to lend it to that particular client. And then it has to come, and then it has to fit, and then they have to like it. And it has to work for that event. - [Booth] And it's a siz

e two, right? - You're lucky if it's a two. - And the girl wearing it on the runway is like 13 years old, hasn't grown into her body yet, doesn't have hips, and you get these actresses who are like super beautiful, and so skinny, and this and that. And they're like, "I'm fat because I don't fit in the thing." And I'm like, "No, you're body is actually" - [Jason] An adult. - Like an adult body. - It's also, people don't realize, models are DNA genetic lottery winners. They just start people that

a lot of times, so. - [Ilaria] But the age has a lot to do with it. - Exactly, but it's also that they specifically go for a certain silhouette, because clothing has to look beautiful on a hanger. So, if it has to look good on a hanger, there's a certain silhouette that looks best on it. So, it is hard to try and make a second sample, because a lot of times, by the way, when you are doing it, you are getting that dress done the night before it walks the runway. - But, also, there are a lot of ho

uses that function because of celebrities. So, those are the houses that I'm sayin, "You already know this is your priority, "and I know marketing and sales happens, "so produce a second sample set." - I just feel like those are even more expensive. - They are. - That is like some Gucci beaded gown, that probably costs like - It's weird that we're not talking about small houses, I'm talking about the houses that have the capability to do it. - The big obstacle is - The thing is, though those are

even more expensive. - It doesn't make sense for them, because they know that will be on a runway, so why make a second piece? If anything, one thing that they could do, which would be wonderful, is to give you a little bit of room. The thing that's nice, with men's, 90% of the time, - You can let it out - You can let it out usually they give you, like a proper designer - In general, men's is so much easier for this. Because, a lot of times that I'm pulling men's, I'm going to the store, and pu

lling from store merchandise. And they have all the sizes. Because, you don't have that thing of like, "Maybe somebody else bought that dress." Maybe you'll be wearing a dress on the carpet that so-and-so bought, whatever socialite. - But it's also styling it differently. Like, you and I, even if we got the same suit, we would do it so differently. - So, with men, it's easier in that sense, it really is more about your personal taste of going like, "Hey, I want that suit." And then you get that

suit. And that has more to do with what you think the person should wear, as opposed to what you can get your hands on. - So, I want to ask about this season in particular, which was obviously very different, because of the metoo movement, and TimesUp, and all of the politics on the red carpet. You've all been doing this for a while. Was it the weirdest season ever, and did that make it more challenging? - It was really - [Ilaria] It was more stressful, it felt like there was more pressure. More

, other things to have to consider than just like, "What's the prettiest dress?" - [Jason] But also, could you get another black dress? 'cause that was the other conversation. - I mean his team was at my house a day before the Golden Globes. We were all in panic mode. Even through the Globes - But we were all on the same we were all on text chains, as well, which was very nice, because it forced us to all talk to each other. - This was probably the first time you probably say that everyone was t

alking to everyone. - [Tara] Everyone banded together - I was getting texts like, "Do you have any edits?" People like, - There weren't enough because it was a decision that was made pretty late in the game. - [Booth] For the Golden Globes black out, right. And Bafta - It made our jobs a little harder, only because some of us had custom things made ahead of time, Bafta was really last minute. I had a custom tux made for one of my clients, for Baftas, that we couldn't end up using, because we had

to do black last minute. And my other girl, Anya Taylor-Joy, was supposed to wear this, mint green Eli Saab. We couldn't use it, because we had to wear black. And so, what I think made it a little tricky, too, is that there was no, like Baftas, they kinda made an official announcement, but for Globes, they didn't. So there was a lot of all of us talking. I was having publicists calling me, being like "Are the men wearing black? "Are the men wearing black?" There was stress like, "Are you even w

earing a black shirt?" It was this whole thing, - [Ilaria] I got a lot of questions about the black shirt. - But it was really good, it was nice. Because it did force us to now get on a chain together, - [Jason] And talk to each other - And be able to actually confer, and find out what we were doing. - That's why I made that Instagram post, where I was like, "The men are wearing black." 'Cause I was like, "Let's just put this to bed, "and make it easier for everybody." - It even got so tough, li

ke with my client Ava DuVeray. Ava was like, "Wait, I heard no makeup, "I heard no jewelry," and I was texting people, and I'm like, "Are you wearing jewelry?" And then I looked at Ava, and I was like, "Yeah, we're wearing makeup, sorry. "We're doing makeup and jewelry." - I do remember staying away from colored jewelry for my girls. - It was really tough, but it also boiled down to the battle of the best black dress. - But it became fun. Actually seeing on the carpet, to see the way that we all

interpreted black. I though that was - I say, it's the best thing. - It was really cool - [Ilaria] But it was a little nerve racking, when Shailene, her Ralph Lauren gown had a lot of crystals. - [Booth] Embroidery, yeah. - Yeah, and I had another client be like, "Is she gonna get in trouble for that?" And I had this moment of like, "Wait!" That was the day before, and I was like, "I don't really!" - But nothing with us we switched our phones out. - Honestly, if you thing about it, in many ways

, if you have celebrities where they've walked the red carpet for so long. There's no industry, and I've said this before, where we can push an agenda, and the fact is that artists, whether it's movie, or film, have always been the progressive front of what's going on. If we can't speak out as a group, about what's going on politically, then there's a problem. Because, we're the ones, if anything, who have been most accepting of being different. The fact is, is that it's a wonderful place that w

e finally found the red carpet being a little more important than what people are wearing. And I think it's been a really refreshing change for the first time, to have people care. And it's not just about what you're wearing. There's a lot more involved. And it was like, "Wow, this is so great to see that this area, where we've gone ahead, and we've been very superficial. Let's be honest, it is part of our business. But to sit there, and you talking about being cerebral. People don't realize, fo

r me to argue a dress, or suit on someone, it's like going up to the Supreme Court. I literally have to to, and, there were times when I would go into a fitting, and I would be putting together a look, and I'd go, these are my arguments, I'm like, researching people, you're trying to convince em. And you're like "I'm gonna go up, "and I'm gonna state my case." And, it's a lot more cerebral, a lot more, and developing that relationship with someone. - And it did send a message, yeah. What is it l

ike when you're working with a designer who is something custom, and how involved are you in the design process as well? - I'm straight-up sketching, and sending visions, and images, and I'm all of that. - People might not know that as well. So, you really are functioning as a designer. - Yeah. I mean, even Yara's custom Prada for the Emmy's. Literally, I'm on the phone with them, I'm like, "She wants this, it needs to feel like this, "this needs to be her last princess moment, de.de.de.puh.puh.

puh.puh.pah Get a sketch back, send a sketch back, I'm literally on Instagram, on the story part. Using, writing on the stuff. - It's so fun, it's my favorite part of the job. Even with Armie's red velvet tux, even down to every button aligning, and the lapel, everything, because, when we decided on the red velvet, I was like, "Okay, I we put a black lapel," - [Jason] I want that suit so bad. - Thanks, but I was like, if we put a black lapel on it, which is what you normally do on a tux, it's go

nna look like Hugh Hefner, or a weird vampire, and I know a lot of people, when they do the color in velvet, they do the black pants on the bottom, but I was like, "I don't want that." We literally did no tux stripe, the buttons, also red velvet, I had them do no contrast, whatsoever. And I had them do a notch, which normally, you would do a peak, or a shawl on a tux, because I felt like it tones it down a little bit, cause a notch is a little more mellow. All those little details is between wha

t makes it work, and what makes it ridiculous. - Do they ever say no? Are they ever - When you do custom? - Oh, yeah. - Well, the thing is, they want it to work. - They want it to be the bran DNA though, still. 'Cause I try and twist it sometimes, and they're like, "Jason, that's not Prada!" (laughter) - I actually originally wanted Armie's tux to be tobacco colored, and they were like, "That's not Armani," and so we went with the red. - You do, within reason, you do have to if not, you're just

going ahead and getting a dress made, or a suit made. - If I remember, Nina Dobrev, for the Met Ball, Donna Karen dressed her, and we literally had to come up with a dress from scratch. So I remembered the dress Gwynneth Paltrow wore in Great Expectations, which was Donna Karen. It's like my favorite dress of all time. SO, I was like, "Do a version of this dress meets "like this other Donna dress that Demi Moore wore in The Campaign, in the 90s, and this and that, so I kinda keep in mind to stic

k to the brands DNA. - Because if not, you would have gone to a different designer. - I think, another one of the misconceptions, too about stylists, is that you are all getting paid under the table, or getting side deals to dress people, or whatever. That's not true, though, right? - Can I say something that is never, ever understood. Makeup artists get paid for putting a piece of lipstick on someone. When they come in to a shoot, they are typically paid their full rate. Hairstylist paid full r

ate. When we go in, for example, for the awards shows, it's typically 1,000 or so, per look. You take into account the shipping, your assistants, and the tailoring, during the awards season, it typically costs up to $1,500 to $2,000, so when you think of the economics of it, I mean, I remember years ago, talking to a huge stylist, who sat there and said, "I'm in the hole, "$25,000 from the last three months." For the variety of clients that she had, from shipping things in from Europe, because W

orld Net, whatever. - [Booth] You lose money. - You lose money during awards season. You actually lose money during awards season. - [Ilaria] Your overhead's so high as a stylist. - And we don't have a union to protect us, at the moment. And the studios have banded together, and given a set rate that is not enough to make it worth time. - It's per look, it's not worth it. - And you can't make it happen, you have to get into an uncomfortable position with your client, who also is saying, "I'm pro

moting this movie, why should I be paying "for my alterations?" God forbid, they're not sample size, or anything like that. - Always need tailoring, pretty much, no matter what. - And if you feel weird about it, you just incur the cost, and then you're in the hole, and so its. - Jessica used to always say that, she's like, "My tailor drives a Mercedes." I mean, because a tailor is getting $4,000. - (laughs) We have the same tailor! - And then, you realized, I just got paid $1,000, and so, when y

ou've gone ahead, and added everything in, you realize, "oh my gosh, "and I forgot about my FedEx bill, "and then, I forgot about the hose, "plus, I had to go get some underpinnings, "or I had to get this." - I just like to feed my interns and assistants. So, that's part of that. And my tailor is like, "Yeah, that great, "I don't wanna wait 30 to 60 days." - Exactly. - So I'm like, "Okay." - My tailor's pretty good about waiting. But I think the brands are pretty good about paying for tailoring,

it depends. If it's worn on the red carpet, the designer will cover the tailoring. (everyone agrees at once) - But usually the presses need less tailoring. - I dunno, not for me. - So, it becomes necessary to have a side gig, if you're a stylist, right? I mean, everyone's got a side gig these days. - At the end of the day, - Side hustle! (laughs) - The aesthetic is key. We're not gonna compromise your look just because I can get a little side cash. That being said, we will openly welcome it, if

it's available. - It's not like you're striking this deal, or you're getting paid. What's happening is that, the brands will say, "I'll pay your rate." They know that we're not getting our day rate, so they'll pay your real day rate. Because, in my experience, to get to sit here, we have to do those types of things. And let me just be 100% transparent. - Sit up, sit up, sit up. - When I first came to L.A., I was working with a lot of girls in music. And I was making a lot of money. So, I went t

o an agency, and they looked at my resume, and my website, and they said, "Well, based on the people that you are working with now, "we don't think that you're ready." This is what they told me. So, that kinda messed me up mentally, and I thought, "But I thought this was a business." I've come from business, you know? And I thought "if you're making money, - that's the only thing that matters, it's bottom line. - "that's the only thing that matters." But Hollywood has this perception of the way

that things are supposed to look. So, I went from making $10,000 a day, at one point, working with someone they didn't think had the right look, to work making $750 a day, for someone they thought had the right. And the messed up part about it, is I felt I had to do it. - That's the crazy thing. - So we take these jobs, and we make less money, and put ourselves in a hole, so that we can be included in conversations like this, and make it to that magazine. - [Ilaria] And it's a little bit compara

ble! - And it's really, in a way, it's wrong. - It's a long game - [Tara] Do you know how many people I know that have gone bankrupt - It's sort of like an actor doing an Indie movie, because it's a better, cooler role, than maybe the big blockbuster. - Sometimes they have back deals on that, - What I'm saying is that - If a movie is going to make a certain amount of money, and this is bringing it back to what you said earlier. There is a certain amount, where if you are insuring if their lead a

ctress or actor is looking phenomenal at every carpet, it is going to garner attention, and vice versa, if they didn't, it's gonna get em on worst dressed list, it's give em a bad. There is a momentum behind it. So for us, it's worth the money to you to ensure that we do our job properly. - It's in a weird situation, though. - I find that some of the studios doing the big blockbuster are the ones that are being cheap. And then you'll dress someone for some Indie movie, and they're paying you a t

on, and you're like, "What?" (laughs) - It also just puts you in a really bad situation, cause nobody wants to go pull their client to the side, and say, "You know what, their not paying me anything." I just had to do something. - And the publicists are like, "Well, then we'll just get someone else to do it." - And that's the problem, you don't want to ruffle any feathers. - Some publicists are good, and they'll fight for you, they know that you should get paid what you're worth, and some of the

m are like, well. - It doesn't matter, it's not me. - It sounds like a bigger conversation needs to happen about that, perhaps. We are nearing the end. This has been so wonderful. I wanted to leave. - I have so much more to say! - But I want to leave with one question about who would be your dream client from the past? It could be someone who's living, or dead, whatever, that you would love to work your magic on. - Audrey and Kate Hepburn. - Does it have to be from the past? - I'm James Baldwin,

all the way! - I wanna dress Conor McGregor and Tom Brady. - I'm James Baldwin, all day. - See, I'm thinking I would have liked to have worked with either Steve McQueen or Paul Newman, as men, or like a Marlene Deitrich or Katherine Hepburn, Because, they seem like they would have taken a risk. - Gotta get Kate in there! - Yeah, and she seems like somebody who would take risks on the other side. - I want to dress Prince. (cheers) - [Tara] Obviously! - [Ilaria] That would be amazing! - [Tara] It

's like a match made in heaven. - Speaking of somebody who would go, he didn't care, he would just wear it if he liked it. Or Bowie, but Bowie is like, "I don't know if I was creative enough." - That was already good. We're gonna leave Bowie. He was so good. - I would have liked to dress Wynonna in the 90s. That would have been fun. Right up my alley. - [Law] I wanted Mariah so bad. I always want to dress people cause I want to be around them, and my favorites when Mariah wore everything. She wa

s every single thing I had heard, or ever imagined she would be, and it was the best-worst thing in my life. (laughter) cause I was there for six hours, and the first day, and I didn't have no dress, cause they called me in two days, and I didn't have the dress, but she was so sweet. And I came back the next day, and got it right, but it was just.. I would have like to work in the 70s, like young De Niro, and young Nicholson, and like Paccino, and Sean Penn. That was pre-stylists. - I would have

just wanted a set up in Harlem, during the Harlem Renaissance, and have every fab. - Can I just go back to one thing that we didn't get to discuss? The awards season is so dramatic, and I know that is one of the things that people are getting bored of. The average amount of looks to begin the season, like if you say you're starting in the summer, if your movie started out. It can run 75 to 100 looks. So, for a people to think that a person shouldn't use a stylist, you'd go bankrupt, and there's

no way that a person could do that. - Not only that, I've met male clients who haven't used a stylist before, and they're like, "ah, I'll just do it myself. "I'm low maintenance." I'm like, "Well, if you're so low maintenance, why do you want to deal with, it's so much work." To get those clothes, to get them tailored. We pack these people like their going to summer camp. Everything is labeled, and organized, and packed for them. A lot of it is just the idea that you're waking up at four in the

morning every day in a different city, when you're doing a press tour. You don't want to have to think about what you're wearing. So, it's like, "There it is, it's what you're wearing today." That's it, you put it on, you don't have to think about it. That's actually - Especially if you've been doing it for like 45 days - my pitch. You're doing that 45 days. You don't even know what the time zone is. To have it done for you. - When we were doing Bradly for American Sniper, we did like six month

s of press. - We appreciate you. Thank you guys - She's like enough! Bye, thank you! (music)