check podcasts hi I'm Bruce Williams I'm CEO of the Greater Victoria Chamber of Commerce welcome to chamber chats coming to you as always from the podcasting studios here at the Czech Media Group I'd like to begin by acknowledging as always that I live and work in the ancestral lands of the lawangan speaking Nations known to us as s Hees and a Squam and chamber chats is made possible by the support of savings a division of first West Credit Union who have a team of experts with Solutions as uniq
ue as your business solutions we're all in the business of trying to find Solutions and among the solutions that we work with right now are ways of increasing our Workforce and we always know that probably the principal source of new workers for this country is immigration and unless any of us are an indigenous person we are all immigrants to this region my case my family came here from Ireland two generations ago so we've all we've all got immigration in our past unless we're indigenous so when
the those folks arrive here they are made to feel welcome and they hope to get settled in by organizations like the Intercultural Association of Victoria we're going to talk today with the CEO of that organization and she is shelle Dello hi Shelley how are you hello Bruce I'm fine thank you thank you for having me on the on chamber chat thank you for being here so you meet somebody and they say what do you do you say oh I run the Ia and they say cool what's that what do you do what's your answe
r um depending on who that is uh I mean the the uh written formal description of a is that we're in the business of supporting the full integration of newcomers immigrants and refugees from a social economic and Civic life perspective in the Capitol region um but I like to distill that down often to say that we're a conduit that we build Bridges between the amazing contributions and life experiences that immigrants newcomers refugees bring to any Reg across Canada um and the host communities tha
t welcome them that that you know give them a place to call home yeah um and that looks like many things that could look like you know access to school access to work access to various supports and of course community and you do it very very well and you help enrich our community by what you do so the so the people you work with the the immigrants some of them are refugees too I suppose how do they find you how do they Source you um a number of different ways and I mean you know as as immigrants
as as newcomers come to the region today's information sources of of course are always the internet and so there's website data there's connections through immigration Refugee and citizenship Canada that would link you to us but the truth is it's word of mouth it's on the groundwork in communities and being able to beware um new comers and immigrants and refugees are so um it's not a linear connect the dots it's just one pathway um we often find that uh it's it's reputational and and good word
of mouth so other newcomers immigrants who have had services at a will recommend us to others who need those Services yeah I mean it's very important very impactful work um how is it funded how do you sustain well um two things we are mainly uh government funded um at all levels of government um immigration is is something that's decided at the federal level uh our immigration levels are are decided at that level and so our governments have a um Keen interest in supporting programs and services
that help newcomers get a quick start um that are able to integrate quickly and integration like yeah I'm sure we'll discuss later looks like different things depending on what the needs are um but we also have a fairly engaged donor base and um where our our government funding supports core programs and services such as settlement language training employment child minding Child Care um Community connections our donor funds allow us to do Innovative work um so to bring uh um uh to answer emergi
ng trends for instance and so some of those things might look like entrepreneurship programs and some of those might look like um specific programs for women so uh women youth or seniors um so it's it's a good mix a good spectrum of supports that we see um but what can I say It's never enough the need is always greater than than our supply so yeah whenever we uh talk with social service agencies like yours and the work that you do we ask the question what would happen if you weren't there what i
f you were not there to provide this service to these people what would that look like I mean I think human nature speaks to resiliency and people do find their way um but that means you know years and years of trying to navigate systems and structures and so on and so forth and so an a comes in um I don't want to quite say parachutes in but but exists to be that conduit to help unpack and explain you know why we do things the way we do in Canada and how you access systems and to translate um ma
ybe certain cultural norms to the Norms that we or or um perpetuate here in Canada I think there's other benefits to an AA so if we didn't exist you know um can can people find work can people learn the language absolutely but an i helps that trajectory like flattens out that trajectory or shortens that Journey um considerably and and that means many things for economies and the growth of communities it means you know growth sooner faster quicker yeah and growth I mean we for us to grow our econ
omy we need immigration for those people to come here and fill those jobs and you uh you do that you finding employment for these folks that are coming to Canada too so what are some of the sort of unique challenges that immigrants face when they get here looking for work um there're many uh and they're not just you know um something that immigrants need to solve or change or shift I think it's a um uh a partnership in in terms of our host communities our employer communities finding ways to loo
k at International experience and truly valuing that um but it's also uh true that you know newcomers need some kind of cultural competency and Communications component so language training is one of the biggest barriers that we'll find um but I often say about language I mean there are certain professions where language and precise language specifically let say in Media or in broadcasting where you need to to have that very clear communication but maybe it's more about functional communication
can I convey what I'm trying to say in an effective manner as as opposed to a perfect grammatical Manner and we often test at that that that space for perfect grammar perfect pronunciation as opposed to con conveying meaning and so language remains that bigger that that biggest barrier I think another barrier and I alluded to this already is being able to um assess the international experience of of newcomers um I'm often heard saying that the globalization ship has sailed and what I mean by tha
t is we're one Global Community we may speak a different language but our systems our Tech Systems our productivity systems they all look similar we're all using computers in This Global age and in this digital age our um our essential skills around numeracy literacy um digital literacy there's a level of Acumen and so when newcomers come to Canada attempting to access the labor market what we often find is that maybe their past experience isn't quite valued the same way despite this globalizati
on of some of these productivity tools um and then education may not always be easy to assess and in the case of refugees um I can point to those who who have left Afghanistan who are highly educated but in that area of war and conflict um may not be able to bring their you know documentation with them there may not be a university out there that is able to quantify or qualify someone's International experience and so when that Refugee or that immigrant comes here and not able to produce some of
those pieces what else could we rely on we could rely on things as you know a learned experience or that um uh professional experience in their professions so there needs to be that bridge um that translation if you will of that International experience to the Canadian Marketplace but as I said globalization has happened right and so the systems that we use um the way we tackle uh data accounting Finance even down to health we're most likely using Global equipment Global products and Global Ser
vices so um it's not an insurmountable problem no well you know there's a lot to unpack in what you've just talked about there uh and of course once a newcomer gets here they have to find housing we're going to talk about that next Our Guest today on chamber chats is shelle Dello she is the chief executive officer of the Intercultural Association of Victoria some misconceptions out there Shelley that people coming new to Canada are using up housing that people are already here could have been li
ving in that's that's kind of a misconception can you help me understand that a little better um yeah I you know Bruce you and I have been around a bit um and so the rhetoric the the tropes around immigration has changed over the years and so I remember when I moved from corporate Canada and into the nonprofit sector um I was tackling uh at that moment rhetoric around you know immigrants will steal our jobs or immigrants are lazy and so um I remember thinking well which one is it are they lazy o
r are they stealing her jobs because if they're stealing our jobs they can't be lazy and if they're lazy they're not looking for jobs so which one is it and so today um you know we we're seeing some of that those tropes again and so we need to explain some of the social problems that we're seeing in our communities housing healthc care um wondering why we are in in these moments of scarcity and sometimes uh those tropes help us easily um pinpoint someone who or some groups that might be an a rea
son for it but if if we peel back that onion a bit um it's not necessarily immigration that exasperates the social problems it's policy it's systems and so I don't mean to paint with a broad brush stroke but you know decades ago we dismantled Canada's national housing policy in favor of free markets meeting demand for housing and expecting that demand um uh expecting that Supply will meet demand um unfortunately though our population is aging we've got labor shortages um fears that the economy w
ill be stunted um we've got other factors at play other than just increased immigration numbers that affect housing uh inflation and the cost of being able to borrow money or to finance a mortgage also creates exasperations to to these systems so um I hate to use the term scapegoating but immigration tends to be the scapegoat by which we we often explain why Society isn't working the way it is and I think if we peel back that onion far back enough um will'll find that immigration while yes it's
putting pressure on on systems those systems were were in um were in in challenging moments anyway and housing is an excellent example of that and so I I'd like to be the counternarrative voice here and say that it's not immigration only sure demand is high but we as a society um have been uh fighting this battle for decades you and I have had this conversation in person and in some public sessions and it's something that the chamber is speaking very loudly about and that is the federal governme
nt's decision to limit the number of international students that are coming to the country we're going to talk about that next Our Guest on chamber chats today is shelle Dello shelle is the CEO Chief Executive Officer of the Intercultural Association yeah so the feds have suddenly come up with this idea that they're going to reduce the number of international student visas Shelly and a number of us were quite surprised by that because a lot of us felt that that wasn't really a very well-informed
decision on on the part of government but that's going to impact post-secondaries with their budgets and their revenue uh it's going to impact Us in creating Workforce because we won't have as many students what else are you hearing around that issue um again you know I use that term scapegoating uh so forgive me here but there is a little bit of that again um you know I I I think there's always there there's more than two sides to a story and uh International students if I can start from the p
lace of an a you know from ass from an asset based lens from an appreciative inquiry lens um contributes something like 20 some odd billion dollars to the economy per year um and not only that I mean International students with their now um canadian-based education um their Global Perspective and therefore Innovative practices that they can be bringing to to Canada in terms of research and development Innovation I know I've said that already but it makes Canada a much more competitive place um a
nd allows us to be better to deal with with competition um not just nationally or um in North America but also globally um um so I think to say we're going to put a cap on International students coming to Canada has some down the road impacts like all policies do um and we'll have maybe midterm to long-term impacts on our ability to be competitive as a nation um the ability to retain those International students as qualified educated um sources of um uh of talent and and experience to our labor
markets um so yeah I I I kind of feel like it was a bit of a knee-jerk reaction to some of the narratives again around explaining why our social systems might not be up to Snuff in this moment are there other ways to approach this you know Bruce you and I have talked about this uh um inid shots and and yeah there there are but to to curtail you know2 21 billion dollars of economic impact um seems I'm going to be critical shortsighted shortsighted no I agree with you that that that's yeah we're g
oing to be speaking with the federal government about that but connected to that when you use the word scapegoating uh that sort of has a tone of racism to it right that sort of activity is that and I know that you provide public education around that for people who are immigrants and non-immigrants so I I'm a guy who doesn't understand racism I mean I I kind of do and it it makes me sick but what sort of education do you offer for people that are are experiencing that or or believe in it well I
think you know ica's antioppressive anti-oppression lens and our diversity equity and inclusion work is a thread that that exists throughout all of our programs and so it doesn't only show up in one part of our agent it shows up in um multiple spaces and places and everything we do um and so we come at all of our work through an anti-oppression lens and what that really means is if I can take a step backwards in answering this question um that anti-oppression lens invites us into look at our ow
n decision-making processes critically and we ask ourselves well there's many questions but i' I I'd um siphon it down to four in this moment and I'd say that um we want to ask ourselves who are we including and why and then the flip side to that question is when we design things Services programs products um invitations to participate who are we excluding and why and at the Crux of those questions when we answer them we can unpack how we've made those decisions and why through that antioppressi
ve lens and then it's it's pretty apparent where discrimination and racism falls through and so IC has had two responses to this that we um have been working with community members at an individual level as well as with organizations um like-minded organizations who would like to shift their organization cultures their organ you know look at organization behavior and organization development from uh diversity equity and inclusion lens there's lots already said about the benefits to diversity in
a Workforce again organizations businesses can move faster quicker because they are more competitive because of that diversity but inclusion is is really the Crux of it right and so um why do we exclude people um and if it is because of racist discriminatory practices and we ourselves intentionally want to make um changes to be more of a welcoming Community to create senses of belonging then we've got to crack that nut so the two programs I I mentioned um one is the bystander or upstander traini
ng and that works with community members on an individual level um to unpack conflict and how we can have open dialogue we're all different we all have preferences but discrimination and racism isn't preferences and there's a distinct difference and and it really lies in who are we excluding and why um or maybe it lies in who are we including and why um and so they go hand inand and that bystander training really um helps us as individuals unpack maybe some unconscious bias um you know some mayb
e passive aggressive thoughts or behaviors because of past experience and allows us to um uh explore some tools and resources for helping us show up for each other in different ways as we meet um in community uh on the other end of the spectrum as we move away from more an individual approach uh with the bystander upstander training we have our tools for Equity training and and programming and that's where we work with organizations and teams who have intentions of embracing uh a Dei lens A dive
rsity equity and inclusion lens we help support through maybe a 101 on Dei so people can dip their toes in the water and get comfortable um and then we work very intentionally with those business owners or organization leaders to um help them develop policies that are inclusive that celebrate diversity um and that allows for safe spaces for that to happen we have run out of time which means we're going to have to do this again because we didn't get to a lot of what we were going to talk about to
day yeah I do want to quickly mention though we're doing something with IC and verks which is the Vancouver Island Refugee Center Society it's something called the new to Canada fund so a newcomer who's been here for three years or less and is coming here for the purpose of buying or starting a business they can draw from that fund to get free membership into the Chamber of Commerce for two years which will then connect them with the greater business community and give them every chance to succe
ed so if you want to find out more about that you can contact me and I'll tell you all about it Shelley Dello thanks for your time thanks for all you do and I really do want to do this again soon wonderful thank you Bruce I really appreciate you having me on the show today and thanks for all you do shelle deelo is the chief executive officer of the Intercultural Association and I'm Bruce Williams we'll see you again for another chamber chat
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