Meet the Press full broadcast — February 25

this Sunday uphill battle I'm not giving up this fight Nikki Haley vows to fight on after losing the GOP Primary in her home state I know 40% is not 50% but I also know 40% is not some tiny [Music] group while Donald Trump says he can't wait for the general election to start I just wish we could do it quicker 9 months is a long time how long will Haley stay in the race I'll talk to Republican Congressman Byron Donald of Florida who is strongly backing Trump plus fertility fight Alabama's Supreme

Court rules that Frozen embryos created through IVF are considered children leading fertility clinics in the state to pause procedures access to reproductive Health Care through IVF is being taken from countless individuals and families embryos to me are babies what will be the legal and political impact I'll talk to Democratic governor Gavin Newsome of California and Ukraine's future the war in Ukraine reaches the 2-year Mark you can't walk away now and that's what Putin is betting out if the

thing you care most about is a conflict 6,000 Mi away you should not be a leader of this country what will happen if the US pulls back support I'll speak with National Security adviser J Sullivan joining me for insight and Analysis are NBC Chief political analyst Chuck Todd NBC News Washington correspondent yamish alsandor former Obama White House senior advisor Stephanie cutter and Lonnie Chen a fellow at the Hoover institution welcome to Sunday it's Meet the Press from NBC News in Washington t

he longest running show in television history this is Meet the Press with Kristen weler good Sunday morning former president Donald Trump is solidifying his grip on the Republican nomination after beating Nikki Haley in the midwest the Northeast the west and now the South Trump delivering a crushing blow to Haley in her home state on Saturday trouncing her by nearly 20 points with nearly 60% of the vote the former president dominating nearly every key group in the south Carolina Republican prima

ry electorate according to NBC News exit poll results Trump Now setting his sights squarely on the general election in certain countries you're allowed to call your election date if I had the right to do it I'd do it tomorrow I'd say we're having an election tomorrow more than 60% of South Carolina Republican primary voters said in exit polls they would consider Trump fit to be president even if he was convicted of a crime but Nikki Haley defiant vowing to stay in the race through super Tuesday

but not saying what will happen after that I'm an accountant I know 40% is not 50% but I also know 40% is not some tiny group in the next 10 days another 21 states and territories will speak they have the right to a real ch choice not a Soviet style election with only one candidate as former president Trump looks to a likely general election rematch with President Biden a growing chorus of his AIDS and allies tell NBC news they want him to fixate Less on personal Grievances and instead focus on

hitting President Biden and unifying the Republican Party the challenges of that were on display on Friday night during a speech at the black conservative federation's annual Gala in South Carolina Trump griped about his legal troubles including for indictments complaining of discrimination I got indicted a second time and a third time and a fourth time and a lot of people said that that's why the black people like me they have been hurt so badly and discriminated against and they actually viewe

d me as I'm being discriminated against we'll get to all of it later this hour but we begin with the 2-year anniversary of the war in Ukraine on Saturday Ukrainian president zalinski promised his country would win the war despite a series of setbacks saying we are 730 days closer to Victory joining me now is National Security adviser Jake Sullivan Jake welcome back to Meet the Press thanks for having me so let's start right there in Ukraine Ukrainian Fighters have been dying they've been running

out of ammunition is this war in Ukraine a stalemate Jake or does Russia now have the upper hand well first Kristen let's take a step back we've just hit the two-year anniversary since this brutal Invasion began and when it began most people on your show predicted that it'd be over in a week or two most people in the US government predicted it' be over in a week or two two years later the capital of Ukraine kees stands the country stands proud and free and resisting Russian aggression so we nee

d to understand that actually Ukraine has in many ways succeeded in thwarting the fundamental objective of Vladimir Putin which was to subjugate the country of Ukraine now Ukraine has also taken back roughly half the territory that Russia occupied in the early months of the war we are looking at some setbacks including in recent days because Ukraine didn't have enough ammunition to defend the town of EV divka in the East but at the end of the day Ukraine still has the capacity if we provide them

the tools and resources they need to be able to Prevail in this war and it is up to us the United States and our allies and partners to deliver on our commitments and that's why it's so important that Congress act and we are going to talk about that fight over the aid in just a moment but I want to ask you big picture does the United States still think that Ukraine can win this war militarily of course Ukraine can win of course Ukraine has already succeeded militarily in one of the most profoun

d objectives it had which was to keep the country from falling into Russian hands it has already done that and Ukraine can go further in retaking territory that Russia has occupied ensuring Russia fails and ensuring Ukraine prevails but it can only do so if it has the tools that it needs and that is why the United States needs to deliver the aid package that passed on a massive bipartisan vote in the Senate the house needs to step up and pass that bill well with Aid stalled in the house I had an

opportunity to speak to the UK foreign secretary David Cameron and I asked him what he thinks President Biden can do on his own take a look at that answer I think what um what Britain has shown I'm not saying we get everything right we make mistakes but right at the start of this conflict we took the view we were going to back Ukraine and back zinski as much as we could so we gave them the anti-tank weapons we gave them the tanks we gave them the longrange artillery and on every occasion there

were people saying including some of the United States saying look this is in danger of escalating and I don't think it was in danger of escalating the conflict what we were doing was giving Ukraine the Weaponry they need to fight off the Russians and I think that is non- escalator I think it's perfectly fair to back a country in its self-defense and I think that the more that the American Administration can see that that's that that works that that others have done it America is doing it now wi

th the longrange artillery and I would urge the Pentagon and the president to you know ER on the side of doing more Jake is President Biden out of options or is there more he can do on his own well it comes down to basic arithmetic we need money to be able to provide the weapons to Ukraine we don't have the money only Congress can provide the money so that's the reality and that's why the urgency of excuse me of Congress passing this bill is so profound and it's why this ultimately comes down to

a simple decision for one man speaker Johnson if there were an up or down vote in this in the house this would pass on a bipartisan basis so speaker Johnson needs to decide will he allow that vote to go forward if he does Ukraine will get what he need needs if he doesn't then the United States will not have the resources necessary to give Ukraine the kinds of tools and capacities that it needs that's what this comes down to and that is the moment that we are at right now Jake what do you say to

speaker Johnson what do you say to House Republicans who say they don't think more taxpayer dollars should be spent on the war in Ukraine until they have a clear understanding of the strategy and what victory looks like there so I've personally gone up and brief the speaker and other members uh secretary Austin secretary blinkin our intelligence Community have all gone up we've laid out in writing how we look at the strategy for Ukraine to Prevail and for Russia to fail in this we've gotten goo

d feedback from the house on that I don't think the question at this point is about the strategy and I don't think the question is about whether there is an overwhelming bipartisan vote in the house waiting to happen the question now is about politics Will Speaker John son bust through the politics in his caucus to put this vote on the floor if he does the resources will flow and we have answered and engaged on the questions relative to the strategy we feel that we are in a good place on that no

w it comes down to a simple uh right right or left turn you know one way is towards a vote that delivers Ukraine what it needs the other way is towards an outcome that Vladimir Putin would love to see which is the United States not stepping up to its resp responsibility let me ask you about Russia as it relates to our next election as you know the intelligence Community has said that in 2016 and 2020 Russia interfered in the United States presidential elections are there concerns or is there eve

n evidence that Russia is planning to interfere in the 2024 election Jake I can't speak to evidence today but I can tell you of course there are concerns there is a history here in presidential elections uh by the Russian Federation by its intelligence services and there's plenty of Reason uh to be concerned and this is not about politics this is about National Security is about a foreign country a foreign adversary seeking uh to manipulate the politics and democracy of the United States of Amer

ica we are going to be vigilant about that and we will Engage The Congress on a bipartisan basis because this should be above and beyond politics let me ask you about Israel Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu yesterday announced that he will convene a cabinet meeting at the beginning of this week to approve the operational plans for Action in Rafa including the evacuation he says of the civilian population there has the president seen this plan has he been briefed on it he has not and bey

ond that Kristen we have been very clear about our view here we're talking about more than a million people who have been pushed into this small space in Gaza because of military operations elsewhere it's also the area where all of the humanitarian assistance comes into Gaza to serve all of Gaza and so we've been clear that we do not believe that an operation a mil major military operation should proceed in Rafa unless there is a clear and executable plan to protect those civilians to get them t

o safety and to feed clothe and house them and we have not seen a plan like that well is the president willing to withhold weapon sales until he does see the plan what's he willing to do in terms of Leverage here so I'm I'm not going to get into hypotheticals because at this time what we are doing is telling our Israeli counterparts privately just as we are saying publicly that we believe that this operation should not go forward until or unless we see that we haven't seen it but we're waiting t

o hear from the Israelis on that front all right National Security adviser Jake Sullivan thank you very much for being here today we really appreciate it and still ahead we dive into the 2024 race with Democratic governor Gavin Nome of California but when we come back will Donald Trump change his strategy as he pivots to the general election Republican Congressman Byron Donalds joins me [Music] next welcome back as former president Donald Trump solidifies his hold on the Republican nomination NB

C News has learned that Trump allies are encouraging him to Pivot to a general election message joining me now is a top Trump surrogate who is also been mentioned as a potential running mate including on Friday night Republican Congressman Byron Donald's of Florida Congressman Donald's welcome back to Meet the Press it's good to be back with you thanks for having me on well it is great to have you congressman and on Friday you introduced Donald Trump at a group of black conservatives he made a n

umber of headline making comments including this one take a look I got indicted a second second time and a third time and a fourth time and a lot of people said that that's why the black people like because they have been hurt so badly and discriminated against and they actually viewed me as I'm being discriminated against Congressman it sounds like Donald Trump was implying that he can win black voters because they get indicted all the time too is that what he was saying well I think it's in pa

rt of that that's part of it Christen look the it was a great night Friday night in Columbia South Carolina the president was really just enjoying himself it was a great celebration for black conservatives across our country but let's be very clear our economy is a mess our border is completely unsecured these things are causes of major concerns for black voters like it is for every voter in our country but then when you layer on the fact that yes this is political persecution from the Departmen

t of Justice and from radical Das throughout our country this is something similar that black people had to deal with the with the justice system themselves and so their their look of it is real simple well dang if the government's going after him with foolishness uh he can't be that bad especially considering the fact that Joe Biden is terrible at his job well con Congressman let's just be clear all four indictments against former president Trump were brought by grand juries there is no evidenc

e that the indictments are political in nature but let me stick to the question here let me get you to respond to Biden campaign co-chair and former Congress Cedric Richmond who said this about his comments Donald Trump claiming that black Americans will support him because of his criminal charges is insulting it's moronic and it's just plain racist how do you respond to that charge that it's just plain racist what I would say is that Cedric is trying to play politics and use racial politics eve

n now as we get into the general election that's one number two like I said at the top the number one reason why minority voters in our country want to support Donald Trump is because he did the job of President he did a great job as president our country was Secure the economy was great these are all things that Donald Trump talked about Friday night he also did talk about the indictments what Americans don't want to see especially black Americans and anybody else they don't want to see a polit

icized justice department they don't want to see a two-tier system of justice they want Justice to be followed they want Lady Justice to be blind that's what the American people want that's what black voters want that's what everybody wants again there's no evidence that the indictments against him are politicized but sticking to this question were you offended At All by his comments Congressman no I wasn't because I understood what the president was talking about and like I I've said now for th

e third time he talked about all the reasons why minority voters want to support him and Kristen let me push back a little bit you have to acknowledge the fact that now that the Robert her report has come out about Joe Biden's misuse of classified information which is a violation of the Espionage Act he had no rights to any of those documents when he was a Senator or vice president yet there are no charges against against Vice against President Biden president Trump is under pru come on we know

that doesn't make any pause button for one minute Congressman because the her report was very clear that there was not enough evidence to bring charges against President Biden and that ultimately there was not that is what the her report said Congressman that is exactly what the her report said yes it is Act is clear the ACT is clear you cannot possess those those documents as a senator or a vice president you have no right to those documents as a senator or a vice president they must remain in

a secure facility Joe Biden took them from a ski that's a violation of the Espionage Act period okay all right bottom line though her himself said there wasn't enough evidence to bring charges let's move on to this next topic though I want to talk about the Alabama IVF ruling this week you said that you agreed with the state Supreme Court's decision that embryos are children I just want to put a fine point on this do you support IVF as it is practiced in the United States which involves the prod

uction of embryos that are sometimes destroyed or even donated if they're unused well first I do support IVF because I have a several friends that have gone through that procedure it has made their their families whole has allowed them to have children their children are beautiful they're wonderful I totally support the procedure number two when uh when the MSNBC reporter asked me that question I was in the middle of a hallway I heard the tail end of it I didn't hear about the Alabama ruing it w

as about do I support that embryos are are should be protected as life look embryos are important to the production of life we all come from embryos that's what I said because I heard half her question but do I support the IVF procedure 100% I do it should be made available and I believe as president Trump has also said we really want the Alabama A legislature to make sure that that procedure is protected for families who do struggle with having children that helps them actually create great fam

ilies which is what our country desperately needs so just to be very clear though if you believe that embryos are children do you think they should be treated as people with all the same legal rights as people well I think now you're getting to a personhood argument and this is where a lot of the details in legislation not just court rulings or important I believe that this is something that the legislators have to make sure they weigh and walk themselves through the IVF procedure is very import

ant to a lot of couples in our country it should be protected I agree with President Trump on that but when we get into these these conversations it's important to delineate from what just one judge might say versus What A legislature and a governor will decide when they go through the legislative process and you raised the point that President Trump is calling for lawmakers in Alabama to take action there is also Federal legislation that is being proposed will you support that would that would

protect IVF services at the federal level like any any type of Bill that gets drafted on Capitol Hill I want to see the devil in the details but yes I could broadly I feel I could broadly support that because like I said IVF is something that is so critical to a lot of couples it helps them breed Great Families Our Country needs that all right let me ask you now about Ukraine and the aid that is pending on Capitol Hill at a town hall in January of 2022 you said that America needed to be engaged

in Ukraine because quote if you essentially allow the bully to bully you're going to be drawn into a broader conflict you do not want to be a part of today you oppose additional Aid to Ukraine what changed congressmen my opposition has been very simple Joe Biden needs to secure our country the first job of the federal government is to secure the nation secure our borders he has failed in that we are going to have 10 million migrants come into our country at the end of his first term just because

he wants to have a open border strategy that doesn't help our our country and so many citizens are saying why are we sending billions of dollars to protect Ukraine while our country remains open so my message has been clear I agree with the speaker you want to talk Ukraine funding let's talk about it but you got to secure America first but Congressman you had the opportunity to take significant actions to secure the border the Senate came up with a deal that some veteran Senators was the best d

eal they'd seen to secure the Border it didn't even include demands by democrats for a path to citizenship for example the border patrol Union even endorsed it how can you make that argument when you opposed that when Republicans oppos that in the house oh it's very easy because it was a terrible deal that bill would have codified all the actions of Joe Biden when he became president there would have been no stop to the flow of migrants going into Detroit Chicago Denver New York Etc it wouldn't

have fixed anything Kristen it was a terrible deal and by the way it didn't even pass the Senate so if it doesn't pass the Chamber of of of Congress it is no deal but but Congress the Border Congressman the border of Patrol unit that endorsed former president Trump also endorsed this plan and again so did a lot of your Republican colleagues on the Senate side who said this is as good as it's going to get so can you really say you did everything and that you have done everything possible for the

Border when you've opposed that deal in the house we passed hr2 it is the most robust border security package ever to pass a chamber of Congress and I stress Kristen hr2 has passed the house the Senate deal did not pass the Senate uh Chuck Schumer and Senate won't even take it Up For Debate he ignores it that's on Chuck Schumer but at the core of this entire question the number one job is to secure the Country Joe Biden doesn't even need legislation to secure the country he could do that right n

ow he can undo all of his executive orders that he put into place when he became president of the United States that's what created the crisis that we have today Cong Congressman as you know executive orders often get tied up in the courts that's what happened under former president Trump but let let me ask you big picture because the government is careening toward another potential shutdown in just days are you willing to shut down the government over border security and I believe Joe Biden is

willing to shut down will you what are you willing to do what are you willing to Congress what are you willing to let me be clear I'm willing to fund the government as long as our border is secure the first job of the government is to secure the Border any business that provides a service if they don't give you the service do you give them money the answer is no Kristen you don't even do that so we have to be honest with the American people the government has a responsibility our cities are over

run our schools are overrun our shelters are overrun and Joe Biden allows the disaster to continue Krist let me add this wrinkle there are young women who are sold into sex slavery by the drug cartels every single day Joe Biden allows it to occur that is unamerican it is not humane border must be secured period Congressman just yes or no and of course the Biden Administration is working on Executive actions as we speak but just yes or no would you vote to shut down the government if you did not

see a border security plan in the package just yes or no I will not be voting for any funding if the border is not secured okay any anything I vote for has to secure our border and the President should agree to that that's simp that's common sense for a nation like America all right Congress Congressman Donald's thank you so much for your time today and your perspective we really appreciate it and when we come back Democratic governor Gavin Nome of California and his thoughts on the 2024 race st

ay with [Music] us welcome back the latest battle over abortion in the wake of roie Wade is happening in Alabama where as we noted earlier the state Supreme Court ruled that Frozen embryos are legally children and that people can be held liable for destroying them setting off a Scramble with implications for IVF and Reproductive Rights on Saturday I sat down with California governor Gavin Nome his pack is going up this week with a provocative new ad in Tennessee where a bill has been proposed th

at would punish adults assisting minors seeking outof State abortions Dr statement please help Trump Republicans want to criminalize young women who travel to receive the reproductive care they need don't let them hold Tennessee women hostage I began by asking Nome what President Biden should do to respond to the Alabama ruling he's speaking with Clarity moral Clarity forcefully the vice president speaking with more clarity forcefully all across this country uh We've defined the lines of this de

bate we've been on the offense not on the defense the Republican party is on the defense on this issue you saw that with a flip-flops of Haley you see that in terms of trump though he's still trying to figure out exactly his position because he's out there celebrating the fact he created these conditions in the first place but here's the point I want to make and that's what this adds about the conditions are much more pernicious than they even appear these guys are not just restricting the right

s of self-determination to Bear a child for a young child young woman but they're also determining their their fate as it relates to their future and life by saying they can't even travel these travel restrictions modeled after a version that passed in Idaho is now being proposed in Tennessee in Oklahoma in Mississippi the AG himself of Alabama wants to criminalize travel not just for children but for adults seeking reproductive care that's how serious this moment is and we need to be even more

aggressive I would argue and that's what this ad represents given the seriousness of this moment that you have just laid out going back to the question is there a unilateral in executive action that you think President Biden should be taking to deal with the IVF piece of this and then as you say the abortion travel ban piece of this there's no daylight in their efforts and the work they're doing and they are investigating exactly where their position can land in terms of the laws itself but at t

he end of the day this is a serious threat not just what's happening in Alabama regardless of what Trump tweets out saying the legislature in Alabama should do about something about this I wor about the United States Supreme Court that again set the tone and tener for the debate we're having today and again it's not just a war on travel it's not just a war on reproductive healthc care it's also a war on women more broadly defined including as we know contraceptives you talk about the Republican

position on this NBC News has confirmed that the GOP front runner Donald Trump has told people privately that he is considering supporting a 16we federal ban that would include exceptions you've been clear and here again today your generous of them to include exceptions what a kind soul and 16 weeks it's because it's an even number well this is these people aren't serious so he supports this is what he said he supports a national ban and if you're Lindsey Graham and others they're going to bring

that down well below 16 he will sign a national ban you want to understand the Contour of this debate that we will be having over the next nine months ironically nine months between now and November and the consequences of Democratic party not succeeding in Biden's re-election just consider the fact that he said that loud that that that part out loud we know that there are reports that former president Obama warned President Biden not to underestimate Trump do you believe that Democrats are und

erestimating Trump In This Moment his strength potentially in a weakness masquerad his strength I I think he's more unhinged he's more he's less interesting than he was even a few years ago I mean you've heard his comments just this week uh more just overt racist comments that he's made it's just extraordinary how quickly he is unraveling in real time including just on basic policy issues like repealing Obamacare which is overwhelmingly supported the highest ACA uh enrollment that we've seen in

decades or rather in years and years just the last few weeks so the reality at the end of the day he's unhinged he's a much weaker candidate than he was a few years ago Democrats are stronger we're winning 18 20 22 23 you saw New York 3 we continue to win we continue to outperform and Donald Trump is a big part of that uh and he's going to be the nominee of the Republican and yet Governor there are some pretty Stark numbers that you're facing 76% of Voters say they have real concerns about Presi

dent Biden's ability to serve a second term do you think it's responsible for Democrats to put him at the top of the ticket given those concerns responsible I rever his record I I mean this what he's done in three years has been a master class close to 15 million jobs that's eight times more than the last three Republican presidents combined the economy is booming inflation is cooling it's 6% more than it was in the summer of 2020 at just 3.1% wait a second we have American manufacturing coming

back home all because of Biden's wisdom because of his Temperance his capacity to lead in a bipartisan manner which is an under represented point and so I have great confidence moving forward so the answer is absolutely Allin in terms of the next four years Joe Biden these voters though are not complaining about his record they're talking about concerns about his ability to beat Trump who you've called a lightning a threat essentially to the Democracy but in private we've heard a lot of we've he

ard a lot of his allies say publicly in private he is strong he's in command he's forceful does he need to do more to show I think he's doing everything he needs to do I mean he's got extraordinary record he's doing everything he needs to do on Ukraine at the moment he's doing everything he needs to do uh to reconcile and wrestle some common sense as it relates to a bipartisan approach to address the issue of the Border where the Republicans couldn't take yes for an answer because they don't wan

t to make that a political issue uh he is leading and so no from my humble perspective not only the last three years have been extraordinary I've been out with as you know on the campaign Dr it was just out in California I've seen him up close I've seen him from far but here's my point it's because of his age that he's been so successful it's because of the wisdom and the character that's developed over years that we have the chips and science act the infrastructure bill and the pack Act and the

sa communities act and because we've seen these bipartisan accomplishments because of his capacity of understanding because of his leadership so the opportunity to express that for four more years what a gift it is for the American people and as a Democrat what a gift for me to make the case for the leader of our party Joe Biden let's talk about you Governor days after that special Council report came out questioning the president's age and his memory The Washington Post reported that anxious D

emocrats reached out to top Biden donors to ask quote when is Gavin getting in or how about Whitmer or Shapiro the buzz has not stopped I know you've been asked this before but do you still rule out a run in 2024 you got to be kidding I I am here celebrating the extraordinary accomplishments of the Biden Harris Administration making the case that we need to make to lift up the issues lift up the record Drive contrast with the Republican nominee to be Donald Trump so that we can win for four more

years have you gotten any calls Governor to run it's all idle chatter it's all it's you know what that's a sideshow I think what Democrats need to do is worry less do more continue to overperform as we have continue to win make the case don't be ashamed a 4.1% GDP over the last two quarters don't be ashamed about the Alliance Management of the Biden Harris Administration don't be timid about making the case for the record of this Administration so you're ruling it out 100% I would it's not even

an interesting conversation and by the way I think it's a damning conversation frankly the other side wants us to have and trust me I know the mishos coming from the other side I'm deeply mindful of the anger machine and all the entertainment industry out there on Fox and elsewhere that love jinning this stuff up at the end of the day not only is this train left the station but we are we get to enjoy a record of accomplishments as we make the the case in a reelection the likes of which we could

n't even dreamt of uh even as a Democrat the last century Trump says he's ready to debate Biden right now should President Biden debate course I mean but should President Biden debate Trump in the prior debates I look forward to I mean this is by the way pure 100% pure projection on a guy who refused to debate in his own primary back to my point weakness masquerading as strength let me ask you about uh immigration very quickly President Biden is reportedly considering taking exec action that wou

ld restrict migrants from seeking Asylum would you support that type of exective action take a look at what it's a broad stroke so before I sign off on any executive action I'd like to know exactly what it is but here's what I will say two things the Asylum system is broken every you're open to it you're open system is broken we know it's game the credible fear is is is manipulated I don't think that we know that as Democrats I have the largest landport in the western hemisphere in the state of

California I'm to be educated on this I've brought the national guard down to the Border many years ago increased their presence recently and I applaud the president being willing to advance a bipartisan solution the Republican party is responsible today now for the conditions that persist because of their unwillingness to work with this president who went farther than any Democratic president in my lifetime on a comprehensive package and Donald Trump called them and threatened them and shows th

e weakness not only of trump but also of the Speaker of the House of representes so Governor given that it is held up in Congress there's no doubt about that do you want to see President Biden act should he take this app the fact that he willing to continue to move forward with this I applaud the fact that he's seeking strategies and solutions I applaud that he's been trying to do that he's been trying to get 1,500 new Customs and Border agents On the Border 4,300 new Asylum officers On the Bord

er he wants President Biden supported $650 million for more wall in investment that's the Biden that's what Biden signed off on so by definition he wants to make progress on the border and yes by definition I support his efforts outside of the legislative P process because the this legisl is broken Congress is broken all right well we covered a lot of ground great to see you see Governor Gavin Newsome thank you so much for being here good to be back and still ahead our panel weighs in on the Sou

th Carolina results and looks ahead to Michigan but when we come back as the 2024 candidates make appeals to Black voters a look back at a presidential candidate who expanded the role of black voters our Meet the Press minute is [Music] next welcome back as we close out black history month we look back to a barrier breaker in American politics the Reverend Jesse Jackson he launched launched his first presidential campaign in 1984 becoming only the second black American to mount a viable Nationwi

de bid for the Democratic nomination the Reverend Jackson joined our broadcast in the final days of his campaign making clear that the struggle for racial equality would not be solved in a single election you must put one foot in the system and one foot outside we must fight for change we cannot adjust the party we must change the party got that right to vote 18 years ago after much Bloodshed and and death and yet 18 years later with this great Brotherhood there 512,000 elected officials about 5

200 the black we got about 1% of the elected officials we're about 12% of the population at this rate it will take us 198 years to achieve parity my generation is restless we must change the system and not adjust to it when we come back how long will Nikki Haley stay in the race and how worried should President Biden be about Michigan the panel is [Music] next welcome back the panel is here NBC News Chief political analyst Chuck Todd NBC News Washington correspondent yamish Alor former Obama Whi

te House senior advisor Stephanie cutter and Lonnie Chen a fellow at the Hoover institution and Stanford University thank you all for being here after a late night particularly For You Chuck Todd because you were just in New York track in all of these results let's remind people of the results Trump beat Haley in South Carolina by a 20 point margin and there's no way to sugarcoat it losing in your home state is devastating in 2016 you had John Kasich and Ted Cruz win their home States Marco rub

win their home States but Marco Rubio lost and got out what were your takeaways and what is Haley's next move do you think I'll tell you there's one the most remarkable number to me in the exit poll was 77% that was the the percentage of folks who said they had made up their mind about who they were going to support um before the start of this calendar year so it meant only 30 and and and and Trump won 70% of those folks so you you only have essentially one in four Republican voters because the

South Carolina Republican electorate I think is a is is closer to being a microcosm of sort of a generic Republican electorate than anything we've we've experienced so far this is probably the most traditional so far so it will it will be semi- repc I think through super Tuesday so what we're seeing here is Nikki Haley is trying to have this conversation about are you sure you want to do this and what about this what about for the last two months she's been trying to have this conversation it tu

rns out only one in four Republican voters are even listening to this conversation so I think we have an idea of how super Tuesday is going to go yeah it's going to split pretty much like this will she do better in Virginia than South Carolina sure and in Vermont in Maine possibly maybe in Massachusetts but it's probably I think we we we know the Contours of this divide inside the Republican party it's a divided party it's just not evenly divided it's a static party from the perspective of Nikki

Haley they're not open to anyone Beyond Trump y me I had an opportunity to interview Nikki Haley a couple weeks ago I asked her what did she need to do to stay in the race she said she needed to exceed what she did in New Hampshire in South Carolina she didn't do that but she's defiant she's in this race do you think if she doesn't do well uh in super Tuesday like Chuck's talking about I mean is that a moment where she's got to re-evaluate and potentially get out you would think that that would

be a moment where she would re-evaluate because by then the race is basically over um she also told you that she would have to be building momentum and that it would have to be close in South Carolina for her to win and obviously as you just said it's 20 points that she's losing by for former president Trump I also think the story as Chuck just pointed out is in the exit polls you see here people saying um if that they believe that Donald Trump is someone who could beat Joe Biden more than she

could the majority of Voters said that they also pointed out that even when it comes to Independence and moderates who she won they're the tiny tiniest part of the go here so you really have in the exit polls the answers to the questions now Nikki Haley says she's still going to be staying in she says it's not about her political future but obviously this is politics so part of this is when I talk to people they think maybe she's looking at 2028 if Trump loses they can say well Nikki Haley tried

to warn us about this or is she someone who just wants to point out hey this is a party that needs to be redirected and we need to start thinking long term but I think for Nikki Haley after super Tuesday it just seems really really hard to justify to her and to her donors how she stays in well Lonnie 2028 I mean if she doesn't drop out and endorse Trump does she have a path to 2028 or is in this Republican party or is that it 2028 is a long time away and and if you look back at what happened in

2016 and you look at the fact that Ted Cruz never endorsed Donald Trump in that nominating process and yet he has seen as somebody who is very much firmly in that camp I I don't know that we can make judgments about 2028 yet but I would say two things generally keep candidates involved in races one is politics and the second is money uh the money Dynamic is very clear for Nicki Haley she still has plenty of resources to run out this race and she's continuing to raise a lot of money I've talked

to many donors uh to her campaign who are interested in continuing to support her because they view that as a way to express a point of view whether she can win not it's kind of beside the issue it's we're expressing a point of view politically that's where it gets more complicated for her and arguably her staying in certainly through super Tuesday and Beyond I don't think it affects her political calculus now if she stays in until May and June it may be a different conversation but certainly ti

ll super Tuesday I think that's a perfectly reasonable thing yeah Stephanie I asked Gavin Nome if Democrats wanted her to get out he said absolutely not she's one of our best surrogates yeah the argu arguments she's making on the campaign Trail are precisely the arguments that Democrats Independents uh never trumpers have been making for 78 years yeah um you know I do think it as a Democrat looking at these numbers and the results of these races there is a strong never Trump um contingent of the

Republican party and the only way Trump wins in a general election is by delivering the Republican vote and then suppressing certain parts of the democratic vote there are real questions about whether he is going to be able to turn out the Republican Party well let's talk about one of the big Contours of the general election it is the issue of Reproductive Rights and now we have this IVF ruling in Alabama Stephanie how significant is this because look at how quickly Republicans have come out in

cluding Byron Donald's today to say no no no no we support IVF Services I might even sign a federal piece of legislation that would protect them they are the the dog that caught the car yeah and they have been fighting for decades uh to overturn row which is what dos gave us uh that Donald Trump brags about he did that uh by appointing um members of the Supreme Court um but you know all of these members that rushed out to say oh we support IVF they're the same members that are supporting legisla

tion right now that would ban IVF so voters are smarter than this and they've proven they're smar of smarter than this since dos um uh came down women have been turning out all over this country to say these are our freedoms you're taking away I think IVF really crystallizes it now it was very much predicted we knew this was going to happen this is not this is not an isolated example it's going to keep happening and Republicans are going to keep tripping over this because their real position is

that yes they do want to ban these things Chuck how do you see it playing out look I think it's fascinating that in a Republican primary in these exit polls we ask you know what's the most important issue and abortions always been one of the top four issues and you know up until this year when you saw abortion in a republican pick abortion it usually meant that they were you know on the on the limiting side of access the pro-life side however you want to uh characterize it what was interesting h

ere is in South Carolina just 10% said abortion was the most important issue and a majority voted for Nikki Haley among those it tells you that this is you know 2022 those midterms I think in 10 years from now historians will look back you know we're sitting there going was it these Trump nominees no that was a dobs election and we may go this may be a Do's decade I there are times that I look at this electorate and I wonder can the Republicans win a national election until they figure out their

position on abortion and I don't know if they can and they're all over the map in terms of messaging they would acknowledge that y you were on the ground in Alabama the human impact of this cannot be underscored the trauma that I talked to um when I when I witnessed women say that they spent years and thousands and thousands of dollars preparing for IVF only to get calls from their doctors the day before that their procedures um were canceled people are going to remember that no matter what hap

pens with the legislation and let's remember Republicans took a week for this for them to really coalescent on the idea that they supported IVF and I was Che with the groups to see what they could say I was in an IVF Clinic where one of the doctors told me she was having the hardest conversations of her life I saw her physically feel relief When Donald Trump said that he was going to come out but she said it was heads spinning to think that politics was the reason why she could now tell her her

her that they can have their dreams again that they won't be crushed Lonnie was say I think we've seen a shift in where the energy is here right the energy now I think if you look at turning out voters and you look at the enthusiasm Gap one of the issues you see is how Democrats have used this issue really to shape the electorate into an electorate that's favorable to political outcomes whether it's in congressional seats gubernatorial races or indeed the presidential contest so for Republicans

messaging around and having a conversation on this issue what Byron Donald's did was exactly right right which is you've got to come out in favor of really a really strong effort on IVF I think nationally and that's where they've got to be all right and all of this the backdrop to Michigan on Tuesday thanks folks that is all for today thank you for watching we'll be back next week because if it's Sunday it's Meet the [Music] Press thanks for watching stay updated about breaking news and top stor

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