The political center needs to stand up to the populists, says Rory Stewart

tonight we are leaving the European Union for many people this is an astonishing moment of Hope a moment they thought would never come and there are many of course who feel a sense of anxiety and loss and then there's a third group perhaps the biggest who had started to worry that the whole political Wrangle would never come to an end I understand all those feelings and our job as the government my job is to bring this country together now and take us forward the most important thing to say toni

ght is that this is not an end but a beginning this is the moment when the dawn breaks and the curtain goes up on a new act in our great National drama which led to Liz truss yeah Minister Boris Johnson announcing the United Kingdom's official exit from the European Union brexit was a contentious issue that was Central to Johnson's win to become the UK's leader in 2019. summon his own party objected to completely pulling out of the trade deal which prompted Johnson to expel them our next guest w

as one of those 21 members of parliament who was ousted for voting against Johnson's brexit deal now all these years later he's reflecting on how England's conservative party has changed and the similarities he's seeing here in the U.S joining us now former member of the British Parliament and Senior adviser of give directly Rory Stewart he's also the author of the new book entitled how not to be a politician a memoir I want to know the answer yeah exactly we want to know the answer to that Mr S

tewart but first let's start by talking about what you grappled with with a once conservative party that turned to hard right populist anti-immigrant you say here that displayed rampant cynicism ignorance glibness and sheer incompetence what's secure for all of that I I think the real cure is that the center or the more moderate people need to sort their act out I think I hate the populace deeply I resigned from Parliament I I lost my seat because of it but when I reflect on it it's not just the

faults of the popular site Boris Johnson it's the fault of us we were not communicating well enough we weren't leading the country well enough and we created the opportunity for the populace to come back and this is true in the United States it's true in Britain it's true across Europe it's it's terrifying and it's to do with many things from the economy to social media but I think this is the big challenge of the next decade tell me why is it that mainstream Republicans what I used to call Mai

n Street Republicans Independents and Democrats in the United States as well as Tories and uh some Tories and and some some member of members of the labor party why do we have such a hard time dealing with the firehood of falsehoods whether they're coming from Boris Johnson's office or Donald Trump's office Forest Johnson's campaign brexit's campaign or Donald Trump's campaign they're revealed to be Lies by video they're revealed to be lies as time passes and yet so many uh people in Britain and

the United States stay with these populists who've been caught and lie after lie after lie I think part of the answer is that there's a little bit of Truth hidden in those lies and and the truth is that the economic system let a lot of people down the 2008 financial crisis revealed that there were big problems in our economies I think our democracy wasn't performing for many people I think Iraq and Afghanistan were humiliating messes and of course the populace exploit that kernel of Truth their

Solutions are ridiculous they're grotesque they're often racist they're divisive but part of the problem is that moderates like myself yes we need to stand up to the populace but we also need a very clear bold emotionally compelling new message of where to take people in the future rather than simply trying to defend the past so uh you can make a case a pretty strong case that brexit altered both the political and financial landscape of Europe and the globe actually and it began well you'll bea

r this out during this whatever you're gonna your answer is going to be David Cameron is prime minister a sort of Dashing youngish figure very glib very articulate and basically just threw it out there voted up or down we have confidence in you uh did he do it out of indifference ignorance why did he do it that way I think he did it out of immense complacency I mean part of this book how not to be a politician which is my 10 Years Journey through all of this is yes it's about how bad the populis

ts were but it's also about how complacent the people that preceded them were David Cameron basically grew up in the 90s kind of fukuyama the end of History he felt that everything had been sorted everybody agreed with him he thought there were a few Fringe lunatics on the right and he could resolve it and how terribly wrong he proved because he destroyed his Premiership he had a terrible effect on the British economy on security in Northern Ireland he's weakened Britain immeasurably and he prov

ided the space for Boris Johnson and populism so tell us a little bit more about the book and congrats again on it about the journey you have you have taken and what you see for yourself next at this particularly precarious moment for your country well I I think the book has partly about the Journey of being a politician and I I feel when I talk to U.S senators and Congress people people underestimate how modern politics is bad for your mind your body and your soul how much time you spend simply

fundraising how much time you spend simplifying how difficult it is to go from campaigning to governing seriously for me I'm now trying to find a way to build myself up again and re-enter politics but it's very tough to do because the truth of the matter is whether you are moderate or whether you're on the extremes the punishing impacts on your family your mental health your life and you end up with very very strange people and the people that we end up seeing on our television screens are not

normal people who can endure this are not normal that's for sure and we witness it every day that's an understatement for sure so Rory you're in New York for the UN General Assembly which is happening this week and you say extreme poverty is the number one thing the UN should be working on how does that play into all the other issues that are crises in the world right now that are issues that should be addressed as well it's terribly difficult as you say we've got to think about climate we've go

t to think about AI but the basic issue of extreme poverty and I I represent an organization that does unconditional cash transfers give directly to the extreme and what we're finding is the solutions there the hope is there for addressing extreme poverty but the problem is immense and Aid budgets being cut all around the world and sadly the focus is going away from the extreme poor so I really hope the UN is going to focus again on the fundamental issue of poverty the new book is entitled how n

ot to be a politician Rory Stewart thank you very much for coming on the show this morning we appreciate it [Music]