No Transformation Without Imagination

Okay so round of applause for our amazing artist  I want to welcome you all to the next panel uh described as no transformation without imagination  my name is Lisa Russell I'm an Emmy award-winning filmmaker and the founder of create2030 I've  spent the last 20 years working as a contracted filmmaker and arts curator at the United Nations  so I love this next panel which is a discussion at the insection of arts and policy now as you  can see we have uh quite a few panelists today for a 45 minut

e session so instead of reading  off everybody's bios I'm going to have them do a quick introduction of themselves and quickly  discuss a little or share a thought on why arts and culture is important in the sustainability  movement so first of all I'm going to pass it over to Jessie who's our Star artist and um  instead of jumping into sort of policy talk I would love for you to maybe just do a quick  introduction on how your journey began and how you gravitated to becoming an artist in the  cl

imate environmental sustainability space thank you so much and uh thank you for the invitation  my name is uh Jessie Kleemann um my family calls me Jessie Kleemann so your family my family now so um  I started out as a very young artist working with um print making drawing and then I'm trained  as an as an actor at the duar theater so for after a long time uh being in Copenhagen I I  felt that all this uh new things coming on to us uh uh scientists speaking about the climate  changes and how the

ice is melting in Greenland and because I'm from Greenland I just really  felt that um this is my world and this is my uh that's that's my suffering that's my suffering  that I want to share and it's a universal kind of suffering because the arcticus means uh the  Arctic and the dorus in pain it's it's Global and we are all facing at the same time so that's  I think very shortly that's why I wanted to to do that kind of work beautiful and I'm sure you have  a a much deeper story than that but t

hank you for being succinct all right in our next uh speaker  we're going to introduce rodion um I am not going to try to pretend to mention your last name so if  you could spell it out for us that would be great do you hear me yes uh thank you very much and  good evening uh everyone my name is Rodion Sulyandziga and uh I am working for international working  group on engineering Affairs it's a international ngos based in Copengagen focusing on human rights  for indigenous peoples originally I a

m from uh Eastern Siberia of Russia in my Community called  which means Forest people thank you thank you so much and our next speaker Gunn-Britt yes hello  everybody and happy Independence Day to Finland um my name yeah I'm Sami person from Northeast  Norway uh based um very far to the Russian really close to the Russian border even closer to the  Finnish border U but by the F facing the East um I work as a head of Arctic and environmental  unit of the Sami Council as pan Sami organization and

I happen also to be a board member of this  International Sami Film Institute which is based in godu and I've known rodion for I think 20 years  and also appeared that we had met 20 years ago when I used to work and live in Copenhagen and  I think um art is important um because it's an eyeopener the indigenous art is an eyeopener for  the larger audience uh to understand our issues and through that we can create alliances in the  society at large thank you very much okay and our next speaker Lou

ise lynon you want to do a quick  introduction greetings yes uh hello Louise from Sweden uh and uh well when I was 18 years old I  actually quit school and started a music festival youth Le music festival for sustainability and I  have worked with um combining uh climate Justice and uh art and culture since then and I believe  it's uh culture has a very important role to play uh to help us to connect to the climate crisis  not only in our mind but also in our heart and we can use it to to turn r

adical imagination uh  into action Fant fantastic and our last panelist solve Corum I'm I'm not sure if I'm pronouncing  your last name correctly welcome thank you so much you're pronouncing it perfectly uh my name  is suai and I work for arts and culture Norway I am a bureaucrat a researcher and a yoga teacher  all kind of mixed up uh but I guess the topic of sustainability and working for culture for art and  cl more for climate issues kind of brings together all these different parts of my pr

ofessional  identities because I do think that we need to work uh with art and culture in a systemic and  infrastructural way but you also need to kind of uh connect with it on the heart mind body and  imaginatory level and uh yeah so I think the power the main power of art is this imaginative spaces  that it opens up to make us move move more freely and be more free and imaginative as humans what  our processes and relationships but in order to do that we need to create the frames and structure

  to enable us to connect and to be in that process together fantastic thank you so much so before we  get going into the discussion I also would love to know in the audience if there are people here who  identify as artist or creative professionals raise your hand right on W okay hands up fantastic so  um so this cop is uh we've seen an unprecedented number of initiatives as well as actual creative  practitioners actually involved in the in the conference and my question to the panelist and  ag

ain we can go uh quickly through each panelist is what do you foresee as the challenges and  also the opportunities for engaging a creative community that might speak a different language  that might work differently than scientists um climate scientists uh data scientist um and and  how we can engage with them in cop conferences in in these settings um again what are some  of the the positives and also the challenges um we'll start with with you Jesse well um I  really believe uh that all the c

hallenges that we face as artists and uh workers in in um culture  sector uh within the these um challenging times at War time uh climate crisis time uh we have to be  included and we have to we have to share where we know already and uh where we come from I think  we have a lot of uh common commonality uh with different uh communities and countries and and  languages and different kind of um sectors and areas within arts and culture but the challenge  is that how how do we uh move freely and ho

w do we um put our work into the agenda so that we also  uh can be heard can be listened to or first of all of course uh as an artist myself I had I had to  learn to listen deeply and go back and uh go back to my own roots and uh uh get to know uh my own  my own pain or suffering or my love for for this planet or for for my fellow human uh Brothers  and sisters but also for for the whole holistic uh place that we call Earth so uh I think there's  always some kind of a a traveling issue in in thi

s where we share knowledge and education and all  the basics but I really believe that um artist must be included first thing yeah and then how  do we speak that next ch challenge next challenge yeah yes first uh let me thanks for bringing us  together and frankly speaking it's something new for me in terms of framework because um what is  climate change is quite clear I mean we don't need any introduction what is just transition I  think many of us we are are trying to understand even from diff

erent Prospect business government  indigenous peoples civil society and conservation Society for instance and culture so for me it's  quite a a new framework how we can combine but it's it looks very interesting and uh bring uh  more opportunities because cultural rights is also part of human rights of indigenous peoples  but from my U Prospect first we should create some kind of common understanding between us  because otherwise if we have different kind of understanding what we are talking ab

out so it's  it would be so challenged to find some kind of solution or even I mean consensus uh but of course  in general we as indigenous peoples we strongly believe in in in in um so-called green economy  or just transition based on uh Paris agreement to move to shift from fossil fusees to Green energy  yes it's quite clear but uh on the other hand uh I think there are several basic lines or even  entry points how clean the road itself to the to the clean energy and uh Evergreen mining can be

be  green so there is still some kind of question we should try to find the answer before fake solution  so and again uh if if you look at indigenous culture is also many things it's not just uh  traditional knowledge language spirituality music and dance it's not even connection only to to  to climate change and solution under the climate battle it's also social Co cohesion which refle  refed in the in their governance and Leadership so which means for me culture of indigenous  peoples uh play

s a critical role in advancing equality human rights and fighting climate change  thank you okay yeah I think art can tell a story in a different way and through ART and artistic  Expressions we can touch people's hearts even politicians Hearts uh so art is in that sense um  I think very important and as indigenous peoples uh again what um rodion also said we have this  holistic approach to things so art and culture in our society is fundamental and Indigenous art also  contains a lot of indigen

ous knowledge uh crucial to keep the connection between humans and nature  uh which we experience um a lot of people are searching for so and and the concept of culture is  broadly defined from a Sami perspective and also includes the material basis for Life uh precisely  because creative practices are so intertwined with the way of life uh our connections to land and  water livelihood cultural heritage traditional knowledge language and our practices so it kind of  ties all this together uh so

in this respect Sami cultural actors and artists have a very important  societal Mission uh to take care of and pass on our creative practices uh our indigenous Sami  knowledge and the life language so but to find the Arenas to reach to the politicians is maybe  the challenge here right right good point okay and Louise you want to take this question uh yeah  definitely I can just uh add to what the others say uh about uh the importance of of stories uh  because the the fact is that we are not on

ly in a climate crisis but also uh a kind of imagination  crisis and we need to tr our capacity to imagine a different future and to do that we need  all kinds of stories from people all across the world um and the truth is we have mainly  dystopian future scenarios uh in our popular stories where you know nature wipes out Humanity  um climate change makes us colonize other planets or technology turns against us uh and we need  more positive stories about the future where we fix this crisis and

we build a better future for  everyone uh and I believe that culture can help us reach more people outside uh these um typical  contexts such as um cop 28 and and and uh other meetings so and we can do that through culture and  through these platforms uh and and also one thing that is important to remember is that artists uh  they don't only have people's attention but also their commitment and Trust when they speak people  listen uh and that's not only an opportunity but also a big responsibili

ty yeah excellent point  excellent and sve uh yes I think what we are now talking about is kind of how culture can raise  awareness and catalyze action about sustainability and climate change and from a policy point of view  that's that's kind of one of the objectives that we're trying to facilitate uh like from system  itself to enable that to happen and another thing that we are aiming to to make happen is to  Foster This Global ecological citizen help to to identify and Tackle sustainability

as a global  issue and that's exactly kind of the point of this panel bringing together different voices to  discuss this across borders and two other Primacy primary objectives that I would like to highlight  from a policy point of view that we have also kind of been touching a little bit upon is to safeguard  and sustain sustain cultural practices and rights which is kind of when you are in the crisis  uh rights issues are pressured and there are also like different um kind of um like there  a

re oppositions within the UN sustainability agenda for example the green Shift versus like  for example the sui people having the rights to culture and to their land uh and so these kind  of conflicts uh are arising and from a cultural point of view and from a policy point of view  it's overall to create uh Frameworks to yeah to safeguard the right and cultural practices  and the last policy objectives that I would like to highlight is the green well like The  Greening of operations in our uh se

ctor as such like to make Productions cultural Productions  Greener like Greener festivals like Louis like it's an excellent representative of and also the  cultural houses big opras the national museums like everywhere and how artists are touring  all these things we need to look into it to be able to yeah maybe make requirements but not only  requirements but also give tools to the sectors to be able to address the issues and not come there  as a state and say like we need to do this and we ne

ed to do that but really make everyone kind of  aware about these issues and make make them feel like they something is at stake for them as well  it's not only the state requiring something or an external part requiring something but it's  our Humanity that is at stake and together we need to create a system an infrastructure that  will be able to hold this new future that we all talking about and that we're already in the  future is happening now so we need to act now yeah thank you so much an

d yes and I agree that  you know creative practitioners and artists are not just spokespeople for sustainability but  we also has to have to be practitioners and so with that said I want to transition over into the  conversation about artist representation um there are some artists who may uh be concerned that you  know showcasing art for example may feel a little tokenistic cuz a lot of times it's just like  you know entertain us you know put on a video sing a song read a poem um and so I'm act

ually  really appreciative that the Nordic Council has decided to include the artist whose artwork  we are seeing as part of this conversation but when you are talking about a relatively  untapped sector who again Works differently speaks differently survives differently how can  we ensure that this movement to engage creative practitioners is just inclusive and sustainable  in this policy and program space because again you know livelihoods are very different languages  are very different but w

e are trying to mesh these two worlds together and how can we do  so in a in a in a meaningful and responsible manner you want to go good G Brit yeah well I I don't know if I'm able to  answer that question but um I was also disturbed by this fly on my my nose so um so I don't really  know what to respond to that um maybe you repeat the question that was sure just in terms of um you  know there are a lot of opportunities to Showcase art as entertainment um we show movies we speak  you know perfo

rm um but artists are also known as incredible creative thinkers and problem solvers  but it's challenging sometimes to get a seat at the table because we are considered sort of you  know I I I compare it to what the youth movement actually went through in the last 10 years of  feeling like um there there is youth washing I still feel like there's some Arts washing so  how can we ensure that this you know untapped community that again speaks differently survives  differently um Works differently

than maybe policy and program folks how can we ensure that this  isn't just a trendy you know arts and culture phase but that we actually in you know ingrain it  and make it sustainable in the movement long term yeah and I could add to that uh artistic and youth  tokenistic at we feel that as indigenous peoples as well as often times we feel that we are giving  and sharing and demanding and uh also brought into panels or into rooms uh as a a token to take off  the box so we had a meeting maybe

it was good but we have been a meet meeting John kery this morning  uh but we did that last year and the year before uh so we don't know what come out of it so so I  think there I don't really know how to what I feel as a Sami person I can maybe say more of that and  I've been working on Arctic environmental policies for 20 years I'm I'm a very patient person in that  sense uh but um oh no I even lost my line uh so so that we uh are engaging and and demanding but  yes so as a Sami person we we a

re uh taken into account when it's about culture or singing and  dancing and then in the Norwegian setting for example we often hear yes no yeah Sami culture  is important important but now the relationship to Russia is more important and uh and then when  it's festivities we taken up and get some artists who sing and and Y and so on and uh we say yeah  but it's very important to protect samic culture because that's a part of the solution to the  climate change because we are uh Guardians of the

nature and the ecosystems uh that remain intact  through our traditional or uh yeah our livelihoods uh but and yet yeah that's important but now  the the um green transition is more important because you have to give up land for the greater  good uh but when the protection of land would be the solution so I think um so again the answer  is probably uh there is always something when it comes to the core decision making or urgent action  and in like in cop here uh and the negotiations get heated

then all this other alternative voices  are left behind uh and they come into core polit politics so I this is a nut to crack I don't know  how to to get that and maybe alliances again is the answer that we uh indigenous people Youth  and artists and so on that we just have to keep kicking yeah yeah it is and I didn't expect you  to have the perfect answer for it um I personally have realize that representation whether you  are a woman a young person an indigenous leader matters in this space an

d right now artists don't  really have representation we are looked at again as entertainers and this became very prominent to  me during covid when everybody recognized that the pandemic had a huge impact on the financial  livelihoods of artists and yet there were consistently Arts contests being put out give us  your artwork for free give us your illustrations for free give us your photography for free and I'm  screaming if you had a a community or Committee of artists who could actually check

you and tell you  this campaign is not ethical it's not sustainable you are harming even with good intentions the  creative Community I think you know we would we would have a better outcome um you look like you  want to say something well I I I I just felt that I wanted to add to that because I think uh um the  alliances that artists make across the borders are really really important and uh to make actions  and um to make not only to make changes but to start changing things together I think

that's uh  and also of course as an elderly artist now I mean it's it's important that we have our lineage to  to the younger generations and our descendants that we have a linkage in in in in all what we  do so it creates um a holistic perspective of the the changes that we want to um Implement for  the coming generations and not just now but for the coming Generations as well so I think um yeah  we we have to teach and we have to make alliances okay I think sve has a finger up does that mean 

you want to speak yes um I well like just kind of in the line of all what we're talking about  now I think it's important to well like now again speaking from a policy point of you I  do think it's important to bring in kind of value questions again into this kind of framework  because the system is kind of very of regarded as no it has some values of course but it's mainly  infrastructure and then the politicians they fill it with with their values but I do think that  when I speak about values

it's not only kind of the rightwing and the leftwing politics and  this polarization but we need to come back to well like core human values and use those in  all our operations like asking questions like is this kind is it compassionate and really put  like up an Integrity lens and a mirror in front of ourselves regardless of where we work and what  we do but as policy makers as Artist as you know people who want to invest in something as kind of  everyone who has a role to play in this field

we need to use that Integrity lens and come back to  the deeper human values and actually play them out on a day-to-day basis and based on that I do think  that we can be able to move a step further in this is it kind is it compassionate no I really love  that um thank you for for speaking that and um I do feel that arts arts and policy makers kind of  speak different languages but are having parallel conversations about improving communities saving  lives Etc and I think if there was a way to b

ring these two worlds together even the playing fields  because a lot of times the power Dynamic favors the policy maker and less the artist um I think we  could actually make some interesting Partnerships and Way Forward and so Louise I actually want to  ask you a question because you work in festivals and one of the conversations we've had is um do  we really want to bring artists into conferences um most artists I know do not voluntarily sign  up to come to a conference they'd rather be at a

festival they'd rather be at in a studio um  I'm wondering if you had thoughts about how we can kind of crisscross our spaces where we come  together could we invite policy makers more into the festival setting more into the studio setting  in the creative spaces instead of expecting the creative professional to sit in you know dayong  conferences and listen listen to people speak it's not how a lot of creative professionals  I know process information or get inspired so just curious if you had

any ideas on that yeah  I have so many ideas and and I believe we need to do both like we need to bring in the artists  and the creative sector in this these spaces uh where we take these very very important decisions  on the future um but I would also love to see more uh like um sustainability um uh Advocates  and and policy makers uh to use these powerful platforms that we have in festivals um we usually  say that festivals they are like temporary cities and they reflect Society so all the cha

llenges we  have in our society from fossil fuel addiction to social injustices they also exist at festivals  and cultural events which means that we can use these spaces to Pro prototype a different future  we can test new ideas uh from like uh Innovations and and products that are more sustainable to  financial systems uh and we can unite different parts of society um while doing this so I think  it's really really important to uh not try to to put these different events like okay so we we  ha

ve these uh political meetings and they are only for policy makers and then we have the cult  C Al events and they are all all only for artists and and um uh citizens but also just try to to  create uh meeting spaces across the borders uh because that's when when magic really really  happens so yeah I would like to see that more fantastic okay so you are eager to say something  yes yeah just very briefly but um I'm not a very uh frequent Festival goer but uh my impression  is is that every elect

ion year there is a lot of politicians in every festival and we have  the Sami Sami Festival ruu which is a cultural Festival which has also a lot of debates and  uh youth camps children's camps and Indigenous music from all over the world they profile  a people uh indigenous people from somewhere in the world every year it's a apparently a  fantastic Festival which I only visited one but but my impression is that there is always a  lot of politicians so so I thought that already happen of but t

hat's during election stuff I'm  talking maybe more on a regular basis but that that's every fourth once a fourth year right right  um let me also say that um so this is my argument about why I would love to see more policy makers  in the creative spaces there's research that was done by a professor at Princeton who looked at  the impact of a Storyteller and that to me means a powerful speaker a musician a poet whatever  um and he used brainwave helmets to look at the brain waves of the Storytel

ler they actually  sync up with the people who are listening to the story and there's also research that shows  that heart rates also synchronize in theater settings so without any physical touch and I know  we've all been in these spaces whether it is a a festival a show a poet slam whatever you can  feel the energy and and storytellers have in their Palm sort of the connection with their  audience and if we can learn how to maximize that and to transition it into um into you know  concern for

the planet concern for the humans I think it it truly is an untapped potential that  we don't understand as much so I'm going to say you need to go to more festivals I will take you  with me if you need to if you need to find some but um but uh yeah Louise you had your hand up  or somebody I saw a hand was it Louise okay yes yeah I just wanted to say that that I I I I'm not  only talking about politicians but also climate activists uh the sustainable innovators that  are creating the solutions l

ike I would like to see more of them also being a part of festivals  because then they can also connect to people and understand people and there were also actually  a research from Sweden uh showing that when when we go to cultural events and sport events  and and music festivals uh we are more uh open to new ideas uh and and we are more uh likely to  change uh traditional behaviors and Norms so it's uh gigantic possibilities here uh for everyone who  wants to work for a more sustainable future

to use these spaces uh not only politicians fantastic um  rodian do you want to say something I know we've skipped over you a few times any thoughts very  briefly because of time pressure um yes agree and uh I frankly share with you that this is also  part of our lobby to bring uh some strong artist singers and performances under our delegations to  any cop because we strongly believe that in many ways music and danc can make more rather than  endless declaration and papers so this is also part

of our strategy yeah and I might suggest that  we even create a space at a conference like cop that is more of a Creator Studio or Festival  space so that artists will feel like they're in their element creative practitioners um but I  would like to also I know we have 10 minutes left um first I would love to talk to the policy folks  about how do we legitimize creative practitioners as stakeholders in this group because I can tell  you anytime you register for a un or government event they wil

l ask you which sector you represent  private sector Academia government Civil Society youth Etc I'm always checking the other box  and putting in Creative sector we still are not really recognized I don't think personally  I don't know if you feel differently how can the policy Community really ensure that this sector is  legitimate in in in terms of being a stakeholder group anyone yes well I can share an experience  from from like actually two experiences two very brief experiences from Norwa

y and the Nordic  countries have we we have done that in the Nordic countries we have this project called sustainable  lifestyles in the Nordic countries and in that field there there are like six different sectors  you have the food sector you have the educational sector you have the well like environmental  labeling uh like the swam uh brand for Eco labeling and you have kind of other you have  gender research and kind of all these kind of seemingly very different projects but brought  togethe

r within this umbrella of sustainable Lifestyles and in the beginning people were just  like but okay the cultural sector what what are you doing here but then kind of when we started to  talk they all of them kind of understood that you can actually be the glue that can help or the glue  or the eye opener and whichever metaphor we use but kind of a sector that can enable all of us to  kind of see our perspectives jointly and express them differently and that was a huge eye opener  for and one o

f the main results from that project and uh yeah another result from that project  it's also like a Nordic road map for cultural institutions I will not go into detail of it but  it's just to share that it's it's there it exists if you're interested in kind of more like the  how to work in a Greener way uh but that's just a parenes here another example from Norway as such  is that we have created the national uh portal for um indicators for the UN sustainability goals not  only the climate goal

but for all sustainability goals and in the first version of this culture and  the cultural sector only had one goal uh relating to the expend expenditure on cultural heritage  and now in this second round we have actually kind of managed to get the hook into many many other  goals and we have had meeting with the financial Ministry with the yeah with the foreign Ministry  with kind of all kind of different Ministries who are in different sectors and kind of shown them  uh how uh we work in the

cultural sector and what we can offer to the society and that's as has  been an eye opener for them and I'm quite proud that we have actually managed to get it into the  national indicator portal for sustainability and it may seem very bureaucratic and very boring  with these indicators but when you start to measure something it's a it's a recognition and  acknowledgement that it matters and like that we have actually stated and formalized that culture  matters and I do think that we need to do

these kind of proactive exercises nonstop and all the  time fantastic okay so I think we're wrapping up so we have five minutes maybe what we can do is  go through each um panelist again with some last minut thoughts um I just want to say personally I  believe that if artists had more power and money we would see a bigger impact in changing the  way our world is right now this is my personal perspective I would love to know from the panelist  um we're here at cop 28 what would you like to see at

cop 29 when it comes to the issue of arts  and culture and any last words you would like to say I really do believe that uh we we should we  should keep showing up and then we should demand our presence every time and uh of course you you  bring up the the finances and um availability of funds it's there we have to go after it and uh  go with it so I mean it's ours you know we're speaking on on behalf of our own peoples but also  on behalf of our community uh in fact we are Bess in art and cult

ure so we have to understand that  and go for our presence together wonderful thank you I think that is very specific uh cop all  of us now um by many reason uh it's some kind of so ironic uh trying to understand why  people are going to Dubai so and for me sometimes like a climate show um so the other  point which is very concerned is it seems that a lot of business are here trying not to make  Revenge but I think trying to increase their position in terms of fossil fuels so um what  we can do

I think uh uh uh we we should keep strong and from my Prospect we don't want  to talk about critical minerals we should start talking about critical peoples critical  cultures so critical nature I think that is our final destination so on our way to the  next cope and maybe particular if you if you look at Brazil maybe we should create  uh cultural framework led by indigenous peoples very good points rodon but I also want  to go back to rodan's previous point the the singer and artist they broug

ht in their delegation  was just fantastic it went straight to the heart uh and this was very touching just to hear her  voice so that's definitely something and maybe to and one other point that I see to more and  more conferences that there are artists drawing the as the discussions are going and that's what  I see more and more of even at the yeah it was in Bon at the substa meeting that there was artists  during the World Cafe drawing the discussions at each table so that is one thing which

is coming  more and more to what I notice and then for the next cop uh so maybe we should more of more of  us should do like uh Rodan has done and bring artists in the delegations and uh and maybe have  I don't know my excuse my ignorance but is there a cultural Pavilion where there could be artists  Gathering and showing but and maybe that could be an idea too if there isn't but uh there is an  entertainment and culture Pavilion it is within the youth women and gender Pavilion um I also  know t

hat I think the UAE has a creative economy focused Pavilion but it's relatively you know  and there's also climate live so there's some arts and culture related entertainment related  stuff but not a full no Pavilion which I would argue would be fantastic yeah and then I like  the rodan's point of critical people thank you thank you very much okay solve any last words  thoughts for next cop well I I do believe that we are on the track of something here and I know  that this climate Heritage netw

ork has worked with a lot of organizations including Julie Julie  bicycle and cultural organizations worldwide to create the joint work declaration towards next  cup and I do think that as many as possible across the world artists policy makers organiz cultural  organizations like however you are involved in the cultural field come and join that uh declaration  and in connection to that declaration there should be a program or a cultural Pavilion is a good idea  but but we need to make sure that

it's not like becoming M entertainment just like relaxation in  between these other important meetings it needs to be like a crucial Pavilion within itself that can  show for example how culture connects to climate colonialism to climate Justice to polarization  issues to climate shame CL climate anciety like Equity diversity inclusion and you know all these  and how also culture contributes to good local societies so all these issues that we who work in  the sector know you know how how it is

connected we need to create a strong F program that can  highlight that and share that with the rest of the world to enable like true integration between  cultural actions cultural policy and environmental policy and the decisions and the steps to take  to go further in this field wonderful and Louise wrap us up yes uh so uh I believe uh cop 29 should  invite more artists as experts and change agents not entertainers it's a big big difference H and  I also want to to really recommend you who are

in Dubai to reach out to climate live it's a youth  L climate movement a climate Justice movement uh that used the power of music concerts uh to  raise awareness and I also o want to say that you should really involve young activists uh  include them and listen to them they are very wise and they really can challenge you and also  bring cop 29 closer to the people why not make it a festival for example cop 29 Festival I love  it all right so on that note we're going to wrap up I just also want

to thank the Nordic Council  of ministers for putting together a panel and again including uh creative practitioners who are  sitting on the panel um alongside policy makers so thank you very much I do hope you stay and  enjoy the reception um I believe our panelists who are here are going to stick around right and  uh yes feel free to connect with our speakers we do have Flyers um in the back we didn't have a  lot of time to go into everybody's bio contacts Etc but they are available in the bac

k thank  you very much thanks for [Applause] coming